GMA240 stereo audio panel... wow!

i am nearing the end of wiring my panel and powered the audio panel for the first time last night. the quality of the sound from the voice circuits is simply outstanding. music source play is so good it makes me feel like i have been flying with mud in my ears for years with my old intercom.

i have been mindful of potential interference from devices or wiring making it to the headsets and have not yet hooked up strobes or started the engine but will be closely searching for any stray sounds as equipment is powered... so far the sound coming into the headset is like a concert hall.

the 240 is pinned out the same as the 340 with two high density d-sub connectors; many pins are not used and i am using so few pins that high density ones sure are not needed. the high density pins are really quiet small and are a bit of a hassle to work with since you can only stuff a 22 gauge wire in, and that with a steady hand and close concentration.

today i am going to wrap up the wiring and test out the telephone interface.

i am quite impressed with this unit, full stereo with full 20hz-20khz frequency response with 3 dedicated stereo sources (2 wired and one panel), a dedicated telephone interface, more comm, nav, aux, and alert connections than you can dream up, all in a package that does not need to penetrate the sub-panel so it can be mounted very high in the panel... nice!

unless you have your heart set on a marker beacon this unit is perfect for a modern experimental with an impressive price point.

Thanks

Stephen

Thanks for the info on the audio panel. I'm in the process right now of deciding between the garmin 240 and the PS 5000ex. From what I understand, the 5000ex does not have a separate audio volume level for the copilot. Guess you have to rely on your individual headset volume adjust. Does the 240 have this capability.

Thanks

Also trying to decide

I've also been trying to decide between these two audio panels. It looks like I can build the wiring harness myself for the Garmin, but I have to order one through PS Engineering for their unit. I haven't priced it exactly, but it looks like it could easily be $300-$400 for the wiring harness alone. That's a pretty big premium compared with the price of the unit.

I went with the 240 because it has music volume and 2 music inputs. I will be using an iPod and XM music and having the audio panel switch feature is nice. I have used PSE products for years and they are really nice too. You can't go wrong with either one.

volume control

marc, the 240 has a separate volume control for the pilot and co-pilot, it also has a master music volume control that is very nice. all of these are controlled with the panel knobs... other rarely changed input volumes can be adjusted with pots on the unit.

Kitplanes PMA5000EX

Dear Marc:

Marc Cook of Kitplanes just wrote a product evaluation on the PMA5000EX. You can download the Reprint from Kitplanes website or ours.

www.ps-engineering.com/pma5000ex.shtml and then click on the reprint link.

One of the things Marc liked was the split mode that the PMA5000EX has as well as our "timed" switched inputs.

If I can help sway you towards joining our family, please let me help

Thank you.

Mark Scheuer
PS Engineering

marchudson said:

Stephen

Thanks for the info on the audio panel. I'm in the process right now of deciding between the garmin 240 and the PS 5000ex. From what I understand, the 5000ex does not have a separate audio volume level for the copilot. Guess you have to rely on your individual headset volume adjust. Does the 240 have this capability.

Thanks

Click to expand...

Wiring Harness

Hey Mark,

I understand your reasoning for requiring a factory wiring harness to avoid the customer service expense in helping customers track down wiring problems. Instead of custom building these for each builder though, have you considered offering a standardized wiring harness though where the factory connector has all of the wires attached with enough length of each type to work for most installations. Building these in bulk could significantly reduce your costs and this could be passed on the the builder. Dynon is doing this with their new SkyView main display connector which appears to be even more complex than the PMA5000EX harness, yet costs only $90.

thanks for your consideration,

Custom Harness

Dear Jason:

Nothing would make me happier than having you, a homebuilder, select our audio panel for your airplane. Having friends in my local EAA Chapter 17, I have witnessed first hand how much work, skill, and determination it takes to make 1000's of pieces of parts into an flyable airplane.

We are probably as anal about things as our customers are about building their dreams. We want our systems to perform as perfectly as they want their airplane to fly.

This year marks our 25 Anniversary. Time alone doesn't really make a company better, but it is what you do with the time you have that separates the also-rans with leaders.

It is my opinion that the audio selector panel/intercom is one of the most difficult electronic devices to install in aircraft. We have learned that if the audio panel/intercom doesn't meet the pilot's expectations, it is invariably the units fault. This is especially true when the pilot creates the loom and installs in the aircraft.

It is also our experience that it is very rarely the audio panel/intercom when all is said in done. Pilots have varying degrees of expertise, and of course there are pilots who are electrical engineers/ham radio operators/electronic technicians that are well qualified to build the loom per the prints.

But it is also true there are pilots are not capable or have the necessary tools to create the audio panel/intercom loom. It is these situations we are unable to accommodate. We have not priced into our systems "technician time for trouble shooting".

So here is where running a small business gets very tough. You want to be all to everyone but the reality is one has only so many resources and treasure. In this situation, we made a "sound" decision many years ago. Our products CAN be sold over the counter (certified and non-certified alike) and have a valid warranty as long as a custom harness is made.

The PMA5000EX is a shining example on the results. While it is true the PMA5000EX is $100 more than our competitor, the IntelliVox, Split Mode, Timed Switched Inputs, and overall implementation is a result of keeping our costs contained.

Finally, we have a flat "Out of Warranty" repair fee of $179

I don't know what it is with the GMA240 but I do know that the flat repair fee of the GMA340 is $600

So if you really want to enjoy building the harness, you are capable and have the correct tools, the chances that you'll need to pay for repair is very small. But what you do need to know is that we are not experienced in installations and rely on our dealers for install questions.

I looked at our work sheet for the PMA5000EX. The base price is $204 and when you add up all of the wire you would need for a two place aircraft, you are looking at a total cost of about $225

And Jason, you'll still have plenty of work to do. You must mount the avionics, route the harness, mount the jacks, solder the jacks to the dressed wires, and of course the check out time.

Long answer to a simple question, but I thought others on the forum would appreciate our view point, and I know that you also want to understand why we have the warranty policy we have.

By the way, unlike our competitor, our warranty is not "send in for repair" but it is a warranty exchange. I don't think there are many avionics companies that have such a program. It is called ProSupport.

Thanks for asking and I will keep hope that we might earn your business.

beav said:

Hey Mark,

I understand your reasoning for requiring a factory wiring harness to avoid the customer service expense in helping customers track down wiring problems. Instead of custom building these for each builder though, have you considered offering a standardized wiring harness though where the factory connector has all of the wires attached with enough length of each type to work for most installations. Building these in bulk could significantly reduce your costs and this could be passed on the the builder. Dynon is doing this with their new SkyView main display connector which appears to be even more complex than the PMA5000EX harness, yet costs only $90.

thanks for your consideration,

Click to expand...

PS 5000X and Iphone

Hi Mark,

I have a GMA 240 installed on my 8 and I really like it, only problem I have not be able to make the telephone function work with my iphone. Does your PS 5000X work with Iphone, that will be a good reason to change my Audio Panel.

Happy Flying/Building

iPhone

Yes, absolutely, the PMA5000EX works very well with the iPhone.

Here is another benefit you will gain besides our IntelliVox and Split Transmit Mode.

If you are using alerts from a MFD or PFD, you might also appreciate our Aux 1 and Aux 2 inputs. While these two switched inputs work like any other switched input (on/off), they will also act as "timed inputs".

Here's the skinny, say you are using a device that gives Terrain Alert Warnings and you are in beautiful VFR weather, you know you are flying right towards a moutain but your plan is to avoid it (makes sense, no?). If you press the Aux button for 1 second, the alert will mute for 60 seconds and then will automatically switch back on.

The benefit is that you can't forget to turn the Aux switched back on and miss the TAWS that you really did need.

Thanks for asking Airbus Pilot.

Mark

AirbusPilot said:

Hi Mark,

I have a GMA 240 installed on my 8 and I really like it, only problem I have not be able to make the telephone function work with my iphone. Does your PS 5000X work with Iphone, that will be a good reason to change my Audio Panel.

Happy Flying/Building

Click to expand...

iPhone in gma 240

my iPhone works fine in the gma 240... you do need a stereo to phone adapter though; i picked one up for about 5 dollars.

beav said:

Hey Mark,I understand your reasoning for requiring a factory wiring harness

Click to expand...

Quite frankly, this has been an irritation to me with the PSE products. Over the years I have fabricated harnesses with no problems whatsoever for 3 PSE intercoms (Citabria, Christen Eagle II, RV-8). While this alone did not prompt me to go with a GMA240 for my -8, it was certainly on my list of negatives when evaluating the 5000 and 240 when I was designing my panel upgrade for the -8. There is no similar requirement for the 240. Garmin recognizes the 240 for what it is - an intercom for the experimental market...

[email protected] said:

my iPhone works fine in the gma 240... you do need a stereo to phone adapter though; i picked one up for about 5 dollars.

Click to expand...

Could you please let us know what kind of adapter, brand part number and maybe a picture.

Thanks!!!

Go to

http://www.ps-engineering.com/docs/Cell_List.pdf

Another advantage is that you can turn on and off the cell phone sidetone from the front panel! That's a huge improvement from what was available before.

Mark

AirbusPilot said:

Could you please let us know what kind of adapter, brand part number and maybe a picture.

Thanks!!!

Click to expand...

tty headset adapter

these are all over the internet... you just need the right key words to get the right part.



the key is that it must have a trrs on the iphone side (4 connector, tip-ring-ring-sleeve) to get the microphone... the adapter sends out mono, mic, and reference ground to the female barrel for a standard 2.5mm trs connector (supplied with the unit).

if you search iphone headset adapter you will find them... buy.com has them for 2.37 with 1.99 shipping... http://www.buy.com/prod/apple-iphone-3g-tty-headset-adapter-3-5mm-to-2-5mm/q/listingid/26101840/loc/111/208466010.html

[email protected] said:

these are all over the internet... you just need the right key words to get the right part.

the key is that it must have a trrs on the iphone side (4 connector, tip-ring-ring-sleeve) to get the microphone... the adapter sends out mono, mic, and reference ground to the female barrel for a standard 2.5mm trs connector (supplied with the unit).

if you search iphone headset adapter you will find them... buy.com has them for 2.37 with 1.99 shipping... http://www.buy.com/prod/apple-iphone-3g-tty-headset-adapter-3-5mm-to-2-5mm/q/listingid/26101840/loc/111/208466010.html

Click to expand...

I bought the same one at MacStore but didn?t work, have you tested???

I bought the same one at MacStore but didn?t work, have you tested???

Are you sure Mic is going from your headset and not you iphone/MIC???

follow up testing iphone with 240

Fernadndo, i spent some time today testing the iphone with the gma 240 and can say definitively that mine works, and all communication is being routed through the headset. one quirk to get the interface to correctly recognize the telephone interface rather than some form of mono music/telephone hybrid was to pull the short connector out and reconnect it... for me the 240 then switched to correctly handling the phone from audio. i only experienced this when going from audio to phone but it may be worth some experimenting.

my iphone, an older 2g 1st gen unit, produces a significant amount of rf chirping when close to an fm radio or a conference phone when it is communicating with a cell tower... pretty irritating... it does the same thing in the plane; generally, the farther away from the panel it is the better. it is okay and will not diminish the utility that it will bring but if i were relying on it for everyday communication it would be unacceptable.

I too, will be choosing between one of these two audio panels for my upcoming panel upgrade.

Just from my viewpoint, the emphasis on 'music' is way overdone. I just want an audio panel that enhances the safety & communications of flying. I can see the use of a telephone interface but not 15 different music/muting modes.

So, given that, do either of these audio panels have some way to interface a digital voice recorder to record incoming calls?

GH

PMA5000EX

Dear GH

Agreed, music is a great capability but isn't the primary function of the audio panel/intercom system.

It is for selecting the one of two radios you have and to communicate with your fellow passenger(s).

Our IntelliVox is the number one function that clearly separates us from the competition. 13 years of shipping our automatic VOX and the results are in. It works flawlessly. The PMA5000EX even has a Very Hi-Noise selection if necessary.

Switching your audio signals coming from your MFD/PFD also has been enhanced. You can install these signals in one of the four unswtiched inputs or into one of two switched inputs (AUX 1, AUX 2). The AUX inputs can be timed inputs. Press for 1 second and you will mute temporarily the annoying audio for one minute.

According to Marc Cook of Kitplanes, "As with its other PMA-series devices,
with the press of a button, the pilot can
be isolated from the copilot and passengers?
or from the passengers as part of
the ?crew.? The GMA 240?s pilot-isolation
mode is managed by an internal
switch, and is by default set to separate
the pilot from everyone else when the
mode is activated. The PMA5000EX can run split coms so that the
pilot can speak on Number 1 while the copilot uses Number 2 at the
same time; the GMA 240 cannot."

You mentioned that a cell phone input might be beneficial. We have added a couple of enhancements to this function. One is turning telephone side-tone on and off from the front panel. This elminates having to remove the audio panel to change the selection as you go from a phone that has side-tone to another that does not.

While nothing is perfect (products or the companies who make them) we really do put 100% effort towards achieving perfection. We have spent the last 25 years working towards that goal and intend to continue to succeed in bringing the best product, best support, to those who seek audio for their airplanes.

Hope this helps you to make a better informed decision.

Sincerely,

Mark Scheuer
PS Engineering
www.ps-engineering.com

GrayHawk said:

I too, will be choosing between one of these two audio panels for my upcoming panel upgrade.

Just from my viewpoint, the emphasis on 'music' is way overdone. I just want an audio panel that enhances the safety & communications of flying. I can see the use of a telephone interface but not 15 different music/muting modes.

So, given that, do either of these audio panels have some way to interface a digital voice recorder to record incoming calls?

GH

Click to expand...

I guess I'm the misfit here, as the best low end audio panel for me would be to drop all the music capabilities, and build in a digital voice recorder to store incoming radio calls for replay.

Well OK, leave 1 music input for the die hards.

I know the top end Garmin unit has this but it is also top end $$$. If I get either experimental panel, I'll immediately look for a way to add the voice recorder externally, using the music inputs.

GH

PMA8000B

The PMA8000B has the built in digital recorder. It would be less expensive than the GMA347 but more than the PMA5000EX.

www.ps-engineering.com/pma8000b.shtml

Mark Scheuer
PS Engineering

GrayHawk said:

I guess I'm the misfit here, as the best low end audio panel for me would be to drop all the music capabilities, and build in a digital voice recorder to store incoming radio calls for replay.

Well OK, leave 1 music input for the die hards.

I know the top end Garmin unit has this but it is also top end $$$. If I get either experimental panel, I'll immediately look for a way to add the voice recorder externally, using the music inputs.

GH

Click to expand...

GMA-240 IPhone Interface Adapter

I was able to find a direct I-Phone to 2.5 MM Cell-Phone cable adapter today from the As Seen on TV Store. Inside this often advertised Jupiter Jack Car Cell Phone interface package was a neat little I-Phone adapter that will let you use any standard Cell Phone Headset on the I-Phone as well as use the 2.5MM Cell phone connector cable that came with the GMA-240 to connect it to the adapter plugged into the I-Phone. It ends up as a Mono-Audio from I-Phone into the GMA-240 and mike out into the cell phone. This can also be ordered from the Jupiter Jack web site.

Cecil
----------------------------
http://www.jupiterjackhelp.com/getadapters.html SKU:3950A

Please Note: This is adapter is included in the original Jupiter Jack packaging.

This 2.5 mm female headset adapter supplies monaural audio from the stereo 3.5 mm recessed stereo audio jack, fits Apple iPhone/ Blackberry 8300 Curve cell phone models/ iPod/ MP3 players, etc. by converting the 3.5 mm male jack to a standard 2.5 mm female monaural audio output for use with any universal 2.5mm accessory such as the Jupiter Jack or a headset such as Jabra, Plantronics, or Shure.
?Apple iPhone Adapter fits the recessed Apple iPhone audio jack, since the Apple iPhone headset port is deeper that the outside casing. This Apple iPhone headset adapter is custom designed to make it easy and convenient for you to connect your standard 2.5 mm mono headsets into the 3.5 mm female port on an iPhone's recessed headset port.
?Featuring a sleek design which isn't big or bulky, simply plug one end of the adapter into the audio jack of your Apple iPhone, and the other end to your existing universal 2.5 mm headset, with or without a microphone, and you're good to go.
?This 2.5 mm female to 3.5 mm male Headset Adapter cable works for all versions of the Apple iPhone.
?Use your high quality wired headset: Allows you to utilize an existing 2.5mm headset with an Apple iPhone.
?Black color cord is 2 inches long.
?Our one year waranty is fast and easy if you should ever need it. Extraordinarily LOW defect rate makes this a popular seller.