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  #21  
Old 01-07-2010, 09:07 AM
ao.frog ao.frog is offline
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Manstad, Norway
Posts: 860
Default .

On the thrusty 737 which pays my bills, I've never seen any zipties.

In the wheel well, which is the place where you really can see how Boeing wire their planes, only lacing cord and adelclamps are used...

Since Boeing doesn't use zipties, they must have a reason...?
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First RV-7 completed, (bought partly finished from a US-builder) 305 hrs per July 2014, SOLD
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  #22  
Old 01-07-2010, 10:04 AM
Bill Dicus Bill Dicus is offline
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Shorewood, WI (Milwaukee area)
Posts: 1,066
Default Zip ties

We've had regular quality zip ties in the engine compartment of our Pitts S-2A for 18 years and 1400 hours with no problem. Wrap a layer of tape around mount before zip tying, and often had two ties overlapped to create a small standoff. Our A&P also often put a blob of high temp RTV as a cushion. So far, no problems apparent. If any look deteriorated it's easy to replace them.
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Shorewood (Milwaukee) Wisconsin
RV-8 N9669D Flying 12/4/14!
Flying Pitts S-2A, Piper Lance
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  #23  
Old 01-07-2010, 04:13 PM
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flyboy1963 flyboy1963 is offline
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Lake Country, B.C. Canada
Posts: 2,350
Default Ziptie colour

..beware the colour-code for temp rating....I found a big pack of black and white assorted ties at the dollarama store. at 3 cents each, they likely aren't rated, just coloured pretty. (the green ones were in the garden tool area!)
Automotive engine compartments really cook these days, so I had a look, and they use a LOT of plastic fasteners in there; they are a bit more exotic than zip-ties, but seem to be of similar material.
Some are pre-padded to be kind to cables and such, and look more professional. (If you can find 'em at your local NAPA autoparts by the bag, probably not too pricey.)
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Perry Y.
RV-9a - SOLD!....
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Lake Country, BC

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  #24  
Old 01-07-2010, 08:01 PM
SHIPCHIEF SHIPCHIEF is offline
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Seattle
Posts: 1,369
Default

Although I love classic airplanes, I'm all in favor of advancing the art of airplane building.
Zip ties have a lot to offer. I'm filling up my engine compartment with expensive and original doo-dads right now, but still have yet to install all the clamps etc.
I would like something lighter, less expensive and more user friendly than adel clamps.
If zip ties have short comings, then taping the sub structure sounds like a work around for the abrasion jarhead mentioned.
I have a work tray about half full of adel clamps of various sizes...the weight adds up.
Sometimes I go to the auto junk yard to see how cars are built, and how they fail. Lots of different fasteners and ties there.
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http://gallery.eaa326.org/v/members/semery/
EAA 668340, chapter 326 & IAC chapter 67
RV-8 N89SE first flight 12/26/2013
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  #25  
Old 01-07-2010, 08:13 PM
the_other_dougreeves the_other_dougreeves is offline
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Dallas, TX (ADS)
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Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by ao.frog View Post
Since Boeing doesn't use zipties, they must have a reason...?
Boeing doesn't use piston engines or props either. They design aircraft to last 40,000+ hr and 20,000+ cycles, and they charge $50-150MM a pop. I'm not trying to build a 777 that's going to be flown 14 hours every day for 25 years.

TODR
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CTSW N621CT - SOLD but not forgotten
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  #26  
Old 01-07-2010, 08:29 PM
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apkp777 apkp777 is offline
 
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Location: Salem, OR (KSLE)
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There are lots of zip ties (panduits) on Boeing aircraft. Some customers order their planes with lacing some with zip ties. High vibration areas and those exposed to the elements get mostly laced.

I know this as I have installed thousands on Boeing aircraft.

I prefer lacing, but nothing wrong with zip ties. Zip ties are much easier to install. I am using a mostly lacing, but in hard to reach areas zip ties. I will try to avoid zip ties FWF as lacing will hold up better IMO.
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  #27  
Old 01-07-2010, 10:27 PM
rv72004 rv72004 is offline
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 452
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I cut lenghts of clear tubing [fish tank type] the same circumference as the engine mount tube. I run the tie thru the clear tube, and it in effect works as my anti chafe cushion.
Therefore, there is never any contact with zip tie and mount.
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RV7 flying
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  #28  
Old 01-07-2010, 11:18 PM
jarhead jarhead is offline
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: PA
Posts: 264
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If you're using zipties FWF, at least use quality zipties. That bag of 100-for-$3 at HF, NT, or whatever bargain store is near your location, just isn't gonna cut it in this application. Use a quality mfgr. like AMP/Tyco, Thomas & Betts (what we use at my .civ job), or Panduit. Personally, I prefer the metal barb style.

If you don't have a Panduit (or similar) tool like Dan posted, go to Home Depot and buy the Crescent 2-piece flush-cutting pliers kit for $14. Once you've pulled the ziptie tight, use the flush cutters to cut off the free end, flush with the "head". This will save you from dozens of ziptie scratches up and down your hands, wrists, and forearms further down the road. Don't use those cutters for cutting anything but zipties, and they'll last a LONG time.

Once more - I do not recommend using zipties directly against engine mounts or hard lines, and I do not recommend using zipties to secure wiring bundles to the airframe FWF.
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Helicopter mechanic (A&P)
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  #29  
Old 01-07-2010, 11:47 PM
Pilottonny Pilottonny is offline
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Belgium
Posts: 645
Default Damaged engine mount: pictures anybody?

I have been hearing this "zip-ties schafing through the engine mount" for years now. Please someone, put up some real pictures, than we can discuss about a real thing. I am not buying it till I have seen it!
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Tonny Tromp
Lanaken, Belgium (EU)
RV9A, Registration: PH-VAN
ECI-Titan IOX-320 with dual EI, turning a Whirlwind 200RV CS prop.
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  #30  
Old 01-08-2010, 05:12 AM
RV8R999 RV8R999 is offline
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: na
Posts: 1,457
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Jarhead - then what would you use zipties for? I agree with the last poster - I've had zipties all over the engine mount of my last plane for nearly 20 years and never saw a scratch (other than on my arms). I agree using high temps, high quality is the way to go.
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