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  #11  
Old 11-10-2017, 11:07 AM
rongawer's Avatar
rongawer rongawer is offline
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Brentwood, CA
Posts: 200
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Manchu16 View Post
Yep the cape is in a shipping container somewhere in Alabama. Or I should say, I hope my goods are still in a shipping container.

My wife asked me why I care about landing lights. She commented don't you just use your night vision devices when it is dark out. This civilian transition is going to be fun.
Hey, you just gave me a great idea for that “extra something” to add to my already bloated RV-12 - NVG’s!

Welcome to CIVPAC, or with you being in Florida, CIVLANT.
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Ron Gawer

- RV-12 N975G, SN 120840, Build in progress...finally on the finishing kit, so, something like 90% done and 90% left to go.
- 1975 B58 Baron, N1975G (a bottomless money pit that makes building an RV look like lunch money, but it's a great airplane, hauls the family and my wife likes two engines...go figure)
- 1961 A33 Debonair, N433JC (R.I.P.)
- RV7A; didn't finish it and donated to kid's club
- Zenith CH601XL; flying somewhere in Louisiana https://youtu.be/wa_Y_A_rP_8
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  #12  
Old 11-11-2017, 09:32 PM
E. D. Eliot E. D. Eliot is offline
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: San Pedro
Posts: 843
Default Rv-12 Add

Following is my opinion - but you asked for opinion and here is mine.

In my opinion, the improvements that Van's has made to the 'new' RV-12 are magnificent. I bought my 12 kit in 2009 and didn't start it for seven years. I will be happy to own and fly it next year.

Having said that, if I were buying another 12 kit at this time, I'd go for the newer Rotax engine - it is superior in every way in my opinion.

Van's has upgraded the 12 kit wonderfully. The primary changes as I see it are the up grading of the whole fuselage front half and the available newer fuel injected Rotax engine. The newer fuselage will be easier to build and, in my opinion, the mechanics have been improved greatly - ie, if you build the 'newer' 12, the fuel lines and the electric wires are no longer 'crammed' into the same area at the bottom center of the fuselage. And I like the new fuel tank and increased baggage limit. There are changes to the cockpit area that I like very much. And dual landing lights and more.

The engine up grade is significant. Fuel injection is clearly an improvement but, as I see it, the chief advantage of using the newer Rotax engine is that that engine has an electrical generating device that makes 30 amps or more - I don't recall exactly how much. The 912-ULS that I will be using has a measly 18 amps available for lights, a second display, avionics auto pilot servos, etc, which means that I probably won't be able to run all of my electrical 'stuff' at the same time.

It is unrealistic to think that the generation/regulation system should be run at or neat its maximum allowed output.

Apparently, the voltage regulator that is sold with my older 12 kit generally doesn't handle an amperage load when loaded up with all of the options. Some 12 owners have experienced voltage regulator failures relatively soon after beginning to fly - 50-200 hours, etc. Some 12 owners however have had no problems with the voltage regulator. It is pretty clear to me that if you run your twelve electrical system near to or at peak capacity, you can expect a relatively short VR life time (when compared to the lifetime of auto voltage regulators or other airplanes).

If you can't afford the newer Rotax then don't buy the 12 kit - when I paid 27K for the Van's RV-12 firewall forward kit, I got everything needed to install the engine - engine mount, prop, spinner, wires, controls, fluid tubes, etc. I hear that the 'new' RV-12 firewall forward kit will be about 5-6K more.

That is a lot of money, I know but I think that you will enjoy your RV-12 more if you buy the better engine. Bottom line is that the 'new' RV-12 will likely have a higher re-sale value with the newer Rotax.

I suggest that you buy the improved RV-12 kit with the improved Rotax. Enjoy.
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Last edited by E. D. Eliot : 11-11-2017 at 09:36 PM.
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  #13  
Old 11-11-2017, 11:46 PM
Phantom30's Avatar
Phantom30 Phantom30 is offline
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Coeur d'Alene, ID/Casa Grande, AZ
Posts: 566
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Quote:
Originally Posted by E. D. Eliot View Post
Following is my opinion - but you asked for opinion and here is mine.

In my opinion, the improvements that Van's has made to the 'new' RV-12 are magnificent. I bought my 12 kit in 2009 and didn't start it for seven years. I will be happy to own and fly it next year.

Having said that, if I were buying another 12 kit at this time, I'd go for the newer Rotax engine - it is superior in every way in my opinion.

Van's has upgraded the 12 kit wonderfully. The primary changes as I see it are the up grading of the whole fuselage front half and the available newer fuel injected Rotax engine. The newer fuselage will be easier to build and, in my opinion, the mechanics have been improved greatly - ie, if you build the 'newer' 12, the fuel lines and the electric wires are no longer 'crammed' into the same area at the bottom center of the fuselage. And I like the new fuel tank and increased baggage limit. There are changes to the cockpit area that I like very much. And dual landing lights and more.

The engine up grade is significant. Fuel injection is clearly an improvement but, as I see it, the chief advantage of using the newer Rotax engine is that that engine has an electrical generating device that makes 30 amps or more - I don't recall exactly how much. The 912-ULS that I will be using has a measly 18 amps available for lights, a second display, avionics auto pilot servos, etc, which means that I probably won't be able to run all of my electrical 'stuff' at the same time.

It is unrealistic to think that the generation/regulation system should be run at or neat its maximum allowed output.

Apparently, the voltage regulator that is sold with my older 12 kit generally doesn't handle an amperage load when loaded up with all of the options. Some 12 owners have experienced voltage regulator failures relatively soon after beginning to fly - 50-200 hours, etc. Some 12 owners however have had no problems with the voltage regulator. It is pretty clear to me that if you run your twelve electrical system near to or at peak capacity, you can expect a relatively short VR life time (when compared to the lifetime of auto voltage regulators or other airplanes).

If you can't afford the newer Rotax then don't buy the 12 kit - when I paid 27K for the Van's RV-12 firewall forward kit, I got everything needed to install the engine - engine mount, prop, spinner, wires, controls, fluid tubes, etc. I hear that the 'new' RV-12 firewall forward kit will be about 5-6K more.

That is a lot of money, I know but I think that you will enjoy your RV-12 more if you buy the better engine. Bottom line is that the 'new' RV-12 will likely have a higher re-sale value with the newer Rotax.

I suggest that you buy the improved RV-12 kit with the improved Rotax. Enjoy.

If you install a Silent Henkie (sp) voltage regulator...problem resolved. No doubt the new 912si is cool, but absolutely nothing wrong with the original version.
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Ric Dickison
307 (CAB) Phantom
Search and Destroy (Can
Tho RVN)
Distinguished Flying Cross Society Member
CH-47 & UH-1H "Driver"
Rotax 9 Series Service IRMT

RV-12 Kit#729 "N312RD" is now a full functioning fun machine!! Thanks Van for fulfilling my dream😎
2017 Dues Paid
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  #14  
Old 11-12-2017, 01:16 PM
scottmillhouse's Avatar
scottmillhouse scottmillhouse is offline
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Madison, AL
Posts: 149
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All the improvements on the 12si are great! What I can not understand is why with all the fuselage improvements, Vans did not engineer all the landing gear fuselage reinforcements to the interior of the fuselage rather than the retrofit exterior reinforcement plates solution. It would eliminate all the crazy cutting to fit the bottom wing skins to match the contours of the add on plates.

Another improvement would have been to eliminate the "L" cut in the lower cowl. You could keep the shelf but just add a vertical rib and extend the fuselage side skin for a straight cut for the lower cowl.
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RV-12 #120515, 319RV 200 hours.
1st flight 12/08/15, flew SNF, Oshkosh, Triple Tree & SERFI in year 1!
RV-9A, 536 hours, sold
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