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  #11  
Old 12-21-2018, 08:32 AM
togaflyer togaflyer is offline
 
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I did the installation based on the Sportsman Glasair installation method. There is a well done five part UTube video series that goes over the method of installation. Except for the windscreen, the Sportman has the same flange design as the -10s. The windscreen was easy to adapt to this installation method. There is no fiberglassing on this type of install. Sika flex and Sil Pruf have many simularities, the products allows expansion and contraction, not so good when you are adhering different materials together then fiberglassing over the top. I used Sil Pruf, which is a silicon product and 100 percent UV. The Sikiflex 295 UV is not silicon, can be painted over, it is not 100 percent UV protected. After some research, I discovered this. The SikiFlex 295 UV is used extensively in the marine industry for adhering plexiglass on boats. There had been a number of failures where it was used without a UV protectant barrier. Take a look at any newer boat. You will see a barrier film adhered to the outside of the plexiglass, protecting the Skiflex adhesive. If you were to fliberglass over the edges, the UV will not be an issue. Fiberglassing over the window edges, or doing the Sportsman method, is about personal preference and how you want your airplane to look. Just decide on the look you want and then go for it. It’s the same amount of work either way. But these products may not be the best ones if you glass over the edges.

Last edited by togaflyer : 12-21-2018 at 08:56 AM.
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  #12  
Old 12-21-2018, 10:51 AM
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ppilotmike ppilotmike is offline
 
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Default Thanks Rich!

So, how did you do the front windshield, using the Sil-pruf? Vans has you add a great deal of fiberglass overlay for the windshield, to act structurally, but also as a laid up fairing too. If one chooses to use a fiberglass overlay (both on the windshield and the door/rear windows) what product allows for differential expansion between the plexi and the fiberglass, without either cracking the fiberglass or the plexi?
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  #13  
Old 12-21-2018, 08:38 PM
togaflyer togaflyer is offline
 
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The top and sides are the same since you have the joggle/flange. The only difference is the Sportsman has a bottom flange where our 10ís have nothing. I did the same taping procedure demonstrated to use with the Sil Pruf, and taped the outside and inside of the entire window. Then I laid a narrow bed of Sil Pruf down where the bottom of the windscreen would rest on the fuselage, when I set the windscreen in. Since the 10s have no bottom flange it does need something to lay over the top, to mat the windscreen to the upper deck of the fuselage. I opted for the Skunkworks aluminum flange. I did some minor adjustment with a Harbor Frieight metal stretch/shrink tool set. Mounted the flange to the fuselage with hardware, along with a thin layer of Sil Pruf layer between the flange and windscreen. (The other option would be to glass in a bottom flange per the plans). I am very pleased with the looks and results. As far as durability, the plane has been flying since February. Just broke 100 hours. It has been exposed to both the Florida Keys summer and the North Georgia cold. It is holding up exceptionally well. Once the plane is painted, all the channels will be filled in with Sil Pruf. This will give it a finished look. The other nice thing I like is that if a window ever needs replacement, (hopefully never but) it will be a much simpler process then having to grind out and relay fiberglass. I can e mail photos of the installed windows if you PM me your info.
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  #14  
Old 12-23-2018, 09:31 AM
lr172 lr172 is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by togaflyer View Post
The top and sides are the same since you have the joggle/flange. The only difference is the Sportsman has a bottom flange where our 10’s have nothing. I did the same taping procedure demonstrated to use with the Sil Pruf, and taped the outside and inside of the entire window. Then I laid a narrow bed of Sil Pruf down where the bottom of the windscreen would rest on the fuselage, when I set the windscreen in. Since the 10s have no bottom flange it does need something to lay over the top, to mat the windscreen to the upper deck of the fuselage. I opted for the Skunkworks aluminum flange. I did some minor adjustment with a Harbor Frieight metal stretch/shrink tool set. Mounted the flange to the fuselage with hardware, along with a thin layer of Sil Pruf layer between the flange and windscreen. (The other option would be to glass in a bottom flange per the plans). I am very pleased with the looks and results. As far as durability, the plane has been flying since February. Just broke 100 hours. It has been exposed to both the Florida Keys summer and the North Georgia cold. It is holding up exceptionally well. Once the plane is painted, all the channels will be filled in with Sil Pruf. This will give it a finished look. The other nice thing I like is that if a window ever needs replacement, (hopefully never but) it will be a much simpler process then having to grind out and relay fiberglass. I can e mail photos of the installed windows if you PM me your info.
I have been planning a Sika installation with no f/g transition, but noticed your comments about UV protection. I am curious if the silpruf gave you a thick and opaque enough color to look good around the outer 3/4" of the window. I liked Jay's look, but the sika uses a black primer that insures a uniform black color through the acrylic and doesn't seem to rely on the adhesive for a uniform color.

Larry
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  #15  
Old 12-23-2018, 12:02 PM
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az_gila az_gila is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lr172 View Post
I have been planning a Sika installation with no f/g transition, but noticed your comments about UV protection. I am curious if the silpruf gave you a thick and opaque enough color to look good around the outer 3/4" of the window. I liked Jay's look, but the sika uses a black primer that insures a uniform black color through the acrylic and doesn't seem to rely on the adhesive for a uniform color.

Larry
If your paint scheme goes for the painted black door pillar style then the paint would be the UV protection -



Is the Sika paintable?
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  #16  
Old 12-23-2018, 12:21 PM
lr172 lr172 is offline
 
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Originally Posted by az_gila View Post
If your paint scheme goes for the painted black door pillar style then the paint would be the UV protection -



Is the Sika paintable?
My paint scheme is similar. Yes, Sika is paintable, but fear the paint may crack, just like the F/G, due to the Sika's 50% expansion ability. The paint has a decent amount of flex, but not sure it is enough. I am thinking the UV is probably not a big deal for a plane that lives in a hanger most of it's life. The issue with the marine windows is that they sit in the elements 24/7,, year long.

Larry
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Last edited by lr172 : 12-23-2018 at 12:24 PM.
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  #17  
Old 12-23-2018, 02:09 PM
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Janekom Janekom is offline
 
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Dorfie refered to me in his post. I have built two 10's using Sika 295 and also helped him do his windows. The trick is not to paint over the Sika and plexi. Then there is no risk of cracking. This is with refence to the four windows. The windscreen is different as you have the bottom section to build up with glass. I do the rest of the windscreen the same as the windows.

By the way - I have had a close look at the Cirrus windows and to me it seems to be more or less the same. They also do not paint over the plexi.

Here is the latest 10 I have done.

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  #18  
Old 12-23-2018, 03:17 PM
lr172 lr172 is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Janekom View Post
Dorfie refered to me in his post. I have built two 10's using Sika 295 and also helped him do his windows. The trick is not to paint over the Sika and plexi. Then there is no risk of cracking. This is with refence to the four windows. The windscreen is different as you have the bottom section to build up with glass. I do the rest of the windscreen the same as the windows.

By the way - I have had a close look at the Cirrus windows and to me it seems to be more or less the same. They also do not paint over the plexi.

Here is the latest 10 I have done.

Thanks for posting. I found your old posts about your method and that got me hooked I like the approach.

A follow up question: How did you hold the window in while the adhesive set up?

Larry
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Last edited by lr172 : 12-23-2018 at 03:19 PM.
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  #19  
Old 12-23-2018, 03:39 PM
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az_gila az_gila is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Janekom View Post
Dorfie refered to me in his post. I have built two 10's using Sika 295 and also helped him do his windows. The trick is not to paint over the Sika and plexi. Then there is no risk of cracking. This is with refence to the four windows. ...
So you use the black paint on the door posts and stop at the black sika line?
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  #20  
Old 12-23-2018, 10:30 PM
togaflyer togaflyer is offline
 
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Jan, nice airplane you have... I wish the 10's were like the Cirrus windows. The difference is that on the Cirrus windows, the flanges are opposite from the 10's. All the side windows mount from the inside. The flange sits outboard so the Sika is not exposed. Definitely would be an easier install all the way around. How much UV impacts an airplane that will be kept in a hanger and/or the cockpit covered while outside, who knows. I agree that I would not paint the Sika. Sil Pruf is silicon so you must be very careful not to get it on anything you plan to paint. Sil Pruf comes in Black, Grey, etc. Both can give you a clean look if done right. Larry, do a Google for the install videos for the Sportsman. I watch it a few times, took notes, and it worked out well. It goes over the install and there are only minor differences when doing a 10.
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