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  #81  
Old 12-02-2018, 08:40 AM
Eddie P's Avatar
Eddie P Eddie P is offline
 
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Yeah when I first watched the video presentation I envisioned it as a huge safety benefit for aerobatics and pattern operations, especially at high density altitude (hot and high) gusty days. This would be in a way a visual system can never compete with. Even with an ergonomically capable HUD presentation or eye glass HUD presentation, the audible translation is a valuable tool as one's focus can be anywhere yet valuable SA is still being provided.
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  #82  
Old 12-02-2018, 05:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by scrollF4 View Post
Walt,
Please watch this video, which Vac's team produced back in the beginning of this effort: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-kbA6NxMpmQ

This is not a mere stall warning system: You already have that.

This projects the AOA range forward to give you audio cues of when you're maneuvering at Lift-over-Drag max and at the optimum AOA for maneuvering (best nose rate without excessive energy loss, which is also the optimum AOA for final approach). Does the Garmin do that?

I can also take you up in KELLI GIRL and demonstrate it with one of Vac's gen 1 boxes...I'm a tester. Using F-4 Phantom-style AOA energy management cues totally changes and improves the way you can fly your RV. My traffic pattern/landing ops are now near-perfect. Imagine the applications for aerobatics!
From a practical standpoint, I would never want all the info (noise) in my headset during "normal" (non-F4) ops. The garmin simply gives you a progressive audio tone from a point you set above stall (Caution-Alert setting which is usually about 1.1 above stall but can be anywhere you want) and then into the stall itself. Personally it does what I want for normal flying but I can see where Vics system may offer advantages for those wanting something other than basic AOA warnings. The Garmin does have visual speed clues similar to Vics, but does not extend the audio into that region.
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  #83  
Old 12-02-2018, 06:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Walt View Post
From a practical standpoint, I would never want all the info (noise) in my headset during "normal" (non-F4) ops.
Nor do I. That’s why I plugged the AOA box’s audio lead into my intercom’s audio input, channel 1. When not needed, I switch to channel 3 and jam to my iPhone’s KELLI GIRL mix.
Righteous tunes, Dude!
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  #84  
Old 12-03-2018, 05:51 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Walt View Post
From a practical standpoint, I would never want all the info (noise) in my headset during "normal" (non-F4) ops.
Thats why its on a rheostat - turn it up when you want it, turn it down or off when you dont.

For sure, not a panacea and not for everyone. But for the price of code, I want the mfg option to choose it.....or not....

Until then, I'll build it.
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  #85  
Old 12-03-2018, 11:34 AM
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Eddie P Eddie P is offline
 
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I like the rheostat option. I envisioned a switch for on/off control. I would not want the AOA tone going off all the time either. It would be managed like a before takeoff/landing/aerobatics flow-checklist item. The rheostat allows a nice volume control all in one.
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  #86  
Old 12-03-2018, 03:14 PM
DaleP DaleP is offline
 
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I like the fact that is warns me if I get to slow in the turns in the pattern . I have my dynon D-180 configured for the earliest warning and it won't warn me that soon.
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  #87  
Old 12-16-2018, 05:51 PM
larosta larosta is offline
 
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Default Gen 2 Onspeed Question - Display

Vac,

I really like the Gen 2 concept and packaging. Just out of curiosity. Are you intending to have some sort of visual display of AoA in this design?

-larosta

Last edited by larosta : 02-10-2019 at 11:19 AM. Reason: Deleted quoted content to save space
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  #88  
Old 12-19-2018, 10:47 AM
Vac Vac is offline
 
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Default Visual Display

larosta,

Right now we're concentrating on the aural piece. We are adding a wifi interface and the ability to add accelerometers as well, so a visual display might be a future project (as will be aural cues for G and airspeed limits).

There is some scuttlebutt about an FAA standard for AOA displays, so I'm interested to see if that amounts to anything. What's different about our project is our system provides energy cues rather than simple progressive stall warning. The FAA is still trying to wrap its collective head around "energy management" and how those concepts apply to GA. It's always an interesting discussion any time you throw out terms like "angle of attack" or "energy management" in a GA setting. The bottom line with the aural logic is you don't have to be an expert in either to simply stop pulling when you hear the appropriate tone--can't make it any simpler than that unless you go to augmented flight controls.

We are still dialing in the algorithm that computes AOA from differential pressure. It took a bit to work out the math required to handle the 50Hz pressure mapping so we are currently flying with a "hard" AOA programmed in the code that is derived from airfoil analysis. Now that that's out of the way, we are moving on to calibration. Our objective remains 1/4-1/2 degree resolution of absolute AOA and good correlation with the thrust/power required curve up through Carson's Speed with caveman simple, accurate calibration.

I see from your profile that you're an engineer--drop a line or PM if you're interested in learning more about the new box or want to help out. We're non-profit, open source and always happy to share technical information.

Cheers,

Vac
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  #89  
Old 01-07-2019, 07:40 PM
williamsericl williamsericl is offline
 
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Vac,

I may have missed it, but will the Gen 2 have the component/wiring diagram and code on Github as well? I think the only thing I've found on Github so far is the audio tone piece.

I like that it is an independent source of AOA so I don't have to buy a full EFIS. I found this today while researching using an Arduino to get the Pfwd/P45 ratio and interpret the AOA or max lift point from that (http://www.nar-associates.com/techni...LowCostAoA.pdf)
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  #90  
Old 01-09-2019, 05:03 PM
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Hi Eric,

Yup--that's Dave Roger's paper and it forms the basis for our Gen 2 AOA logic. Dave has been gracious enough to help us out as we develop the system. We'll publish the design for the Gen 2 once we finalize it--we're close, but we are adding some test points to the board and want to build three and test them before we publish the design. We are starting a website at flyonspeed.org and we'll post all of the information there and we'll also update the GitHub site.

Here's a couple of photos of the system described in the paper

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1bSO...ew?usp=sharing

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1IQR...ew?usp=sharing

The test rig is on a standard RV inspection plate and will fit in any -7/8/9/10 or 14.

The Gen 2 system marries up the software in the paper you reference with the ONSPEED aural logic. At the moment, we are partnering with the folks at Spin Garage to modify one of there nifty flight test booms to talk wirelessly to the Teensy processor in the Gen 2 box--this will allow us to marry up the flight test data real time.

Our objective is to have the baseline AOA and aural tone working on the final board configuration by OSH time next summer so we can start beta test. We are also looking at collaborating to determine what's in the art of the doable to build boxes for folks that aren't interested in building their own system, and we added some accelerometers to the board for future growth capability.

If you drop an email to vacf15 at yahoo dot com, I'll be happy to share a Gen 2 schematic with you.

Cheers,

Vac
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