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RV14 panel design - give us any advice

romanov

Well Known Member
.



Hello fellow builders,

It is first time I am designing IFR panel full of
avionic devices I never used (yet). So please
give me your best opinion on the work so far.

Your experience here is the most valuable piece
of information that can be.

Thanks a lot:




vEwmkXc.jpg


bMrzFiI.png
 
I might be WAY too anal here but, being right handed, I never want to have my right hand have to leave the control stick to change frequencies, change AP settings, etc. Thus, all the important stuff is accessible by my left hand. Cavate- I fly a -8 so the panel is way narrower.
 
I really like that you've incorporated some backup steam gauges. They break up the tyranny of the rectangle!

I think it's a very clean design.
 
I might be WAY too anal here but, being right handed, I never want to have my right hand have to leave the control stick to change frequencies, change AP settings, etc. Thus, all the important stuff is accessible by my left hand. Cavate- I fly a -8 so the panel is way narrower.

I am not that experienced pilot, but while studying on Cessna-152
I do just that all the time. Both the coms are just above the throttle.

I guess I can live with that. :D
 
Hello fellow builders,

It is first time I am designing IFR panel full of
avionic devices I never used (yet). So please
give me your best opinion on the work so far.

Your experience here is the most valuable piece
of information that can be.

Thanks a lot:




vEwmkXc.jpg


bMrzFiI.png
[/QUOTE]
 
I like the layout, only change I'd make would be to swap the D10A for Garmin G5, lighter and doesn't take up as much space behind the panel and I think about $1000 less. Also, do you need the GMA 350? You might look at the GMA-245, save a few bucks there too, unless you are dead set on adding a marker beacon.

Lynn
 
I like the layout, only change I'd make would be to swap the D10A for Garmin G5, lighter and doesn't take up as much space behind the panel and I think about $1000 less. Also, do you need the GMA 350? You might look at the GMA-245, save a few bucks there too, unless you are dead set on adding a marker beacon.

Lynn

Yeah, I am looking for the markers option
Want to have the full ILS.
 
I might be WAY too anal here but, being right handed, I never want to have my right hand have to leave the control stick to change frequencies, change AP settings, etc. Thus, all the important stuff is accessible by my left hand. Cavate- I fly a -8 so the panel is way narrower.

I also fly an 8 and am right handed but I disagree. I can hold the stick temporarily with my left hand and manipulate instruments with my right hand WAY better than the other way around. Especially in bumps!
 
Do you not want to have all the autopilot controls at the same place?

It is not that easy to solve that puzzle:
to have it all good looking and also in
the most convenient positions. This
is the best we got so far.
 
Just throwing in my personal opinion?s 2-cents worth here, but i think you have more than adequate refundancy with the left skyview and the D-10. If I were designing this, I would delete the steam guages and the right-side skyview and use the money saved to upgrade from the GTN 650 to the far more user friendly GTN 750, which would then serve as an excelent second ?MFD? for displaying things like traffic, weather, IFR plates, etc. I would then use the space freed up on the right side to install a ram-mount supporting an 11? iPad pro running ForeFlight or whatever app is best suited to sharing skyview air date with the iPad. The ram mount allows you to tilt the iPad directly at the pilot?s face for a very pilot-centric system with more options and utility than you will have with that second skyview that the pilot has to lean over to look at.

I have great respect the Dynon Skyview products, but would also encourage at least a look at the Garmin G3X touch with a G5 for backup, which results in a system the really works well with the iPad and talks nicely to the GTN. You can do your flight planning on the iPad and squirt that (and software updates as well) right into the G3X system. There are probably ways to accomplish this with Skyview as well, but all-garmin is really good for consistent iconography and a simplified learning curve as much is shared between the G3Xand the GTN, which you will need to master in any event. Just a thought- Dynon is great too and much-loved by many pilots.

Here is a plywood and and photo-mockup of the all-Garmin system I am working on for my 7A. Only the iPad and phone are real.- Otis

2v2EHs31hxBELK5.jpg
 
Some thoughts:
- D10A over the G5 - it is far more capable and where you have it there is no behind the panel space issue.
- I installed an altimeter and airspeed analog instruments in my RV-10 above the GTN-650 as you have it (good use of the shallower space). I found I alway use the airpeed instrument for takeoffs and landings, never in cruise or climb. I also found I never used the altimeter - it got deleted on the new RV-8 panel.
- The rocker switches seem to be in style - but they take up a lot of valuable panel space. There are other options to explore.
- The Knob panel is used more than anything else. Consider putting it low, right in front of your left hand.

Carl
 
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My two thoughts "out of the box":

1. Seems a bit busy for my taste. Is that much capability / redundancy really needed? (in particular I'm referring to the 3 large dials top center - lots of space for information that is also on the PFD/MFD/Backup screens). There's a lot to be said for simplicity and using the capability of the primary systems (Dynon Skyview in your case) to maximum effect.

2. Having just wrapped up most of my panel work, I found space behind the panel to be at a premium. Think really hard about that and plan carefully where every box, and all the wiring you'll need (as well as air lines, etc). will go....
 
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My advice is to sit in the plane do the typical print out bit or just try and visualize where everything is going to go. I spent years working through my panel design during the build and now it's perfect.... for me that is. That's the thing you're the one flying it and we all have our favorite vendors or preferences on various aspects.

My preferences;

- I prefer the two glass panels in front of the left seat, because I'm flying. If I was doing some dual pilot set up, or wanted to fly from the right then obviously I wouldn't like my panel.
- I see no value in steam gauges. I actually love the look of them but they take up a lot of space, limited in capability compared to say a D10/G5.
- I like my audio panel and AP head in a typical radio stack configuration with the AP head above the panel. I prefer not to look down to fiddle with things.
- As already mentioned I don't see the need for Marker Beacons. With your IFR GPS there is no need for a marker beacon. But if you're used to and love that sound then by all means keep them.
- I love rocker switches, when you light them all up it looks amazing! Just make sure you're happy with whatever switch layout you end up with.

Ultimately you're the one flying so take suggestions (Including mine) with a grain of salt.
 
Radio

After a few hours I moved the skyview radio closer by swopping with the skyview intercom as I found it too far away. Yours looks far away to the right.
Like mine was.
Even using the “tune com” button on the skyview you still need to push buttons on the radio and CHECK you have the right freq.
And selecting dual often. Fiddly. Hard to see if not in front of you.
BUT looks like you will use the garmin 650 as main radio.
 
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Not an RV14 but one that I recently completed on an RV9...
Clean, functional and works like magic.

IMG_7842rev11200.jpg
 
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I fly professionally and havent used marker beacons in like 20 years. Id skip the cost of them.
 
I, too, would remove either the D10A or the three analog instruments at the top... My personal preference would be to remove the analog. Can't comment on Dynon vs. Garmin, i'd say try both, price both (including yearly update costs) and decide based on that. Both have great options.
 
I fly professionally and havent used marker beacons in like 20 years. Id skip the cost of them.

I am curious: don't you have towers that
wont let you land unless you have full
ILS system - including the markers.

Can you guys share your expirience here?
 
Never used those, can you give us some
more details, in what cases you use them?

I have a remote mounted GD40 with a test and light on my panel. It's integrated with the EFIS but if CO2 gets higher than a particular level it will alert me. Much more accurate than those stick on detectors.
 
I am curious: don't you have towers that
wont let you land unless you have full
ILS system - including the markers.

Can you guys share your expirience here?


Dont get me wrong, we have them... however no one listens to them or watches for the little lights. On most ils’s the markers have been named with gps referenced fixes. The inner markers normanlly are not but on aircraft going that low you are looking at radar altimeter by then (or synthetic vision or huds).

https://www.ivao.aero/training/documentation/books/SPP_ADC_Navigation_Marker.pdf
 
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some ideas

Nice layout.

Why not a "push button" start? like most cars these days.

Get rid of the "steam" gauges. No need. for redundancy, perhaps think about another 650 instead. One 650 for each side for each MFD.

The 650 has comms and VOR. So you get two GPS, two comms, two VOR.

Think about getting rid of all the breakers and install the hidden controller systems a lot of guys have.

Most "right handed" pilots all learned to fly with their Left hand (right hand for throttle, avionics, etc...). For a two-place front seat this makes the most sense.
 
My random observations in no particular order:

1. Eliminate the steam gauges entirely. The AI will require a vacuum pump. Save the weight and eliminate a part you'll have to replace every ~500 hours or so. As for the airspeed indicator and altimeter, you have two backups in the form of the PFD (in reversionary mode) and the D10A. In my opinion, adding those steam gauges is overkill. Also, consider an battery backup for the EFIS such as the one made by TWC Tech.

2. There is a school of thought that says use a different manufacturer for your backup AI/Alt/AS/DG. Supposedly if there is a software glitch one of the boxes, it's in all of them. I don't know if there is any actual data to support that notion, but it's something to consider.

3. I can't read your switch labels, but I would consider grouping switches by general function (e.g. lights) with enough space between them so it's easier to find the correct one. Critical switches should be isolated from non-critical switches. For example, it's a bad idea to put the avionics master next to the fuel pump. I'd hate to be on the ILS in the muck and accidentally turn off the entire panel trying to switch on the fuel pump. In this case, I'd isolate the fuel pump switch by itself. Don't bury it in the group.

4. Don't consider the panel in isolation from the rest of the pilot interface with the aircraft. Consider what functions you should locate on the stick and how that will dovetail with the functions on the panel. There are several great threads on stick switches that go into considerable detail. I'll leave you to search them out.

Good luck and keep us appraised of your progress. This is the most fun part of building an airplane (for me anyway).
 
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I am curious: don't you have towers that
wont let you land unless you have full
ILS system - including the markers.

Can you guys share your expirience here?
I had it in my old plane, used it once to see if it works. After that, I never had a use for it. I have not installed one in the new plane.
 
Just throwing in my personal opinion?s 2-cents worth here, but i think you have more than adequate refundancy with the left skyview and the D-10. If I were designing this, I would delete the steam gauges...

Second that. Antiquated and you already have backups (I assume you intend to install the usual backup batteries that are available for whatever devices).
 
BTW, I find the audio panel on this design WAY too far over to the right. I'd put it above the 650, in a "traditional" radio stack manner.
 
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