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Plexiglass Rear Window

Paris12Man

Paris12Man

Well Known Member
I purchased the plexiglass rear window some months ago from Carl Eldridge ([email protected]) and I just wanted to let everyone know that his work is excellent and the window fits great. He marks the centerline for you and all you have to do is drill the holes (no big deal.) I think the dark window (you can have clear or light tent) looks real good, and being made out of plexiglass removes the danger of gasoline damaging the window.
Jan24-11002.jpg
 
DanWright said:
Does anyone know why Vans did not use plexiglass it in the first place? Weight and cost come to mind.
Click to expand...

Hi Dan,

I think it is because with Lexan they could use a flat sheet, the Plexiglas requires forming to fit the application but it is better suited to the task in the RV-12. Van's would have had the cost of producing the formed window and it would have been another large item to ship, so we get flat Lexan and try to keep fuel off of it, when we have a spill we can replace it with the Plexiglas.

Best regards,
Vern
 
vernhendershott said:
Hi Dan,

I think it is because with Lexan they could use a flat sheet, the Plexiglas requires forming to fit the application but it is better suited to the task in the RV-12. Van's would have had the cost of producing the formed window and it would have been another large item to ship, so we get flat Lexan and try to keep fuel off of it, when we have a spill we can replace it with the Plexiglas.

Best regards,
Vern
Click to expand...

As the first one to craze his Lexan, I must admit I asked that question myself. Vern is right, it was a cost issue. Which is not to said it was a bad decision based on their mission. From the start, Vans insisted they would explore every cost opportunity that didn't compromise safety. Lexan works fine if you don't spill gas on it. I did, not Vans. Its nice to know there is a plexiglass alternative available now for those that wish to pay slightly more money.
 
Don't know if it was a consideration, but Lexan is stornger than Plexiglas. It may be a factor in rollover protection. Lexan is also generally more expensive then Plexiglas. However, not having to form the Lexan in this application may be the deciding factor.
 
They weigh the same. I also replaced my gasoline cracked Lexan window with the plexiglass unit. An uncracked plexiglass window is stronger than a cracked Lexan one!
Larry
 
History lesson?

We've been using clear plastics for what, 80 years? in aircraft....and other than the odd ultralight trike windscreen that may flip or hit something, lexan is just not the right material.
I'm not a -12 builder, but it looks like the flat wrap is well within the manufacturers specs for 2 or 3mm plexi....so it could have been spec'd here, not necessarily a formed piece.
Van's choice may have been sound, for their reasons, but it doesn't make it a good long-term solution.
ANY Lexan I've used, when cold formed to a bend, eventually crazes, yellows, and then you can't see thru it, especially at the angles in this cockpit arrangement.
Lexan was designed as high-impact flat glazing, has moisture content, and it's properties all change for the worse as you expose it to sun, air, grit, cleaning etc.
I hate to say it, but I"m finding a lot of content in my -9a that I have to question. Seems we are throwing away the Van's part, and buying a better one later, time and time again ( instruments etc.) would I buy a kit if it was $5000 more? maybe not....but it seems penny-wise, pound-foolish.
 
I just got my tinted rear window from Carl. Nice work, really. He has a unique shipping technique that reduces the freight charge to something around $30 with USPS, so it's really not a big deal to get one. I am currently storing it in the very box the Finish Kit came in. and it fit reasonably on top of the canopy with a layer of protective cardboard in between. So, the shape of the formed rear window was certainly not the issue to use Lexan for Van's as they could have just thrown it in the same box the flat one came in.
IMG_5610.JPG
 
LittleJoeA said:
Don't know if it was a consideration, but Lexan is stronger than Plexiglas. It may be a factor in rollover protection.
Click to expand...

Lexan is stronger because it is more flexible. More flexible is no help in a rollover.
Lexan is also softer and scratches more easily.
 
He made me one the same weekend he made Torstens. However, I opted for delivery by his RV7! How can you beat that?
 
Plexiglas Window

Carl is a joy to do business with. The window is perfect and his instructions are great and he responds immediately.

Mine went in very easily and I love it!

Doug Dahl
9A and working on the canopy on the 12
 
I think I know the answer, but I will go ahead and ask. Do I have to wait until after certification to install this aftermarket window?
 
skydiverlv said:
I think I know the answer, but I will go ahead and ask. Do I have to wait until after certification to install this aftermarket window?
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Legal answer is yes. I do not know any DAR who would be able to notice the change if you did not tell them.

Be sure to make the log book entry for the change after the DAR has signed it off.

Best regards,
Vern
 
I have pondered this myself, but believe I will go ahead and take my chances, since in the worst case, I can remove it and put in the factory window.
 
I have been using a product called "Plexus" to clean and polish the canopy and rear window. The other day I had a big "burb" while filling the tank and some 100LL splashed on the lexan.:eek: However, no damage! Maybe the Plexus is putting a coating on it that sheds gas? Or am I just lucky?
 
Plexiglas Window Delivery

Carl personally delivered my rear window today, used his "air freighter" service, which doubles as his beautiful RV7a!
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information

Please provide contact information for the person who is supplying the aftermarket rear window. I am interested in one for my 12.

Thanks:D
 
Send me a personal message and I will give you his email address. Probably attract spammers if I put it on here. Woops, I see your email address, will send it off.
 
Paris12Man said:
I purchased the plexiglass rear window some months ago from Carl Eldridge ([email protected]) and I just wanted to let everyone know that his work is excellent and the window fits great. He marks the centerline for you and all you have to do is drill the holes (no big deal.) I think the dark window (you can have clear or light tent) looks real good, and being made out of plexiglass removes the danger of gasoline damaging the window.
Jan24-11002.jpg
Click to expand...

Does anyone know if these are still available?
 
Rear Window?

Rear Window?
I live in Florida and would like to know from people who are flying the RV12 if the rear window view is necessary or if you could just use aluminum instead to help keep the heat out.

Options Please

Thanks
 
Aluminum blocks radio signals

I live in Florida and would like to know from people who are flying the RV12 if the rear window view is necessary or if you could just use aluminum instead to help keep the heat out.
Click to expand...
Due to the antenna location, the ELT might not work as well with the polycarbonate replaced with aluminum. The antenna could be relocated.
Joe Gores
 
aluminum

Thanks Joe
The Antenna could be relocated easy.

Any other draw-backs or advantages.

I Think I will do this if there isn?t any good reason not to


aluminum should be stronger
Mich48041 said:
Due to the antenna location, the ELT might not work as well with the polycarbonate replaced with aluminum. The antenna could be relocated.
Joe Gores
Click to expand...
 
joedallas said:
Thanks Joe
The Antenna could be relocated easy.

Any other draw-backs or advantages.

I Think I will do this if there isn’t any good reason not to


aluminum should be stronger
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The window does have structural significance to the aft fuselage.

Use caution if you choose to install something in its place. It would be foolish to make the assumption that aluminum would be stronger.
It might be... but depending on the thickness chosen... it might not (lexan is extremely tough material)
I personally would not want to give up the side visibility to the aft rear just for something totally opaque to bloc the sun. (and don't say I don't know the heat issues... I flew in Phoenix for 20 years).

A better choice in my opinion would be to add some very dark tint film to the top areas of the canopy and rear window
 
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Aluminum vs. Polycarbonate

Scott I have a Structural engineering background and I'm sure the aluminum will have enough sheer strength to equal or surpass the polycarbonate.
The side visibility to the aft right rear is of concern and not having flown in a 12 I?m not sure how much it will hinder the view. All opinions welcome.
My Eyes are very light sensitive.
Thanks




rvbuilder2002 said:
The window does have structural significance to the aft fuselage.

Use caution if you choose to install something in its place. It would be foolish to make the assumption that aluminum would be stronger.
It might be... but depending on the thickness chosen... it might not (lexan is extremely tough material)
I personally would not want to give up the side visibility to the aft rear just for something totally opaque to bloc the sun. (and don't say I don't know the heat issues... I flew in Phoenix for 20 years).

A better choice in my opinion would be to add some very dark tint film to the top areas of the canopy and rear window
Click to expand...
 
joedallas said:
Scott I have a Structural engineering background and I'm sure the aluminum will have enough sheer strength to equal or surpass the polycarbonate.
The side visibility to the aft right rear is of concern and not having flown in a 12 I?m not sure how much it will hinder the view. All opinions welcome.
My Eyes are very light sensitive.
Thanks
Click to expand...

Joe, I'd suggest that Scott is correct to advise caution. Both strength and stiffness are important, and you will need to work out the correct thickness of aluminum to use to replace the Lexan panel. You may be surprised if you check the material properties and do some numbers.
 
joedallas said:
Scott I have a Structural engineering background
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Thats good. Then you already know that there are many factors to consider when comparing one material to another in the context of strength.

So, for the non engineers lurking on VAF.. The RV-12 had to pass a huge # of static load structural tests, the majority of them, most people aren't even aware of.

A number of the tests were related to strength of the tail cone portion of the fuselage (because of the loads that can be induced by the stabilator and rudder).

The rear window structurally contributed to passing these tests. It is for that reason that I suggest builders exercise caution when experimenting.
 
Rear Window

Thanks for the structural concerns.

I looked at all the numbers of comparison to equal or exceed all anticipated loads, not knowing the actual induced loads.

I?m ok with my results, THIS IS NOT AN ENDORSEMENT - All Structural changes should be reviewed by a Structural Engineer.

Structural consideration aside.

My concern is the view and if I should add a Right and Left Rear Window.
Any Comments on the view will be appreciated.

Thanks
 
I'm not an engineer, nor do I play one on TV. I won't even address the structural question. I did, however, make special notice today of the visiblity portion of the question.

Before doing this I would highly recommend getting some time (more than a quick flight) in a -12. On the Pilot's side, looking over you're left shoulder, you probably wouldn't notice the difference. Looking over your right shoulder, on the other hand, would make a huge difference.

Without the back window you wouldn't be able to see below the back of the right wing. You would have a rather large blind spot. If it were me, I would feel uncomfortable with that blind spot.

Again, recommend spending a few hours in a -12 before making the decision.
 
Rear window

I thought about eliminating the rear window also. Decided I would rather be done building and flying. You could always paint it.
 
Rear window

Carl just responded to my email about purchasing his rear window. Told me he no longer makes them. Any other sources for lexan?
 
Two Small Windows

Thanks for the reply to the question that was asked.
The right rear window was my concern also.
I will use Aluminum with two rear side windows of Plexiglas.



ArlingtonRV said:
On the Pilot's side, looking over you're left shoulder, you probably wouldn't notice the difference. Looking over your right shoulder, on the other hand, would make a huge difference.

Without the back window you wouldn't be able to see below the back of the right wing. You would have a rather large blind spot. If it were me, I would feel uncomfortable with that blind spot.

Again, recommend spending a few hours in a -12 before making the decision.
Click to expand...
 
Plexiglas or lexan

Plexiglas or lexan ?

I Live in Spring Hill Fl

I was going have van delete the rear window from my kit
If you want it Email me
Thanks

paul mosher said:
Carl just responded to my email about purchasing his rear window. Told me he no longer makes them. Any other sources for lexan?
Click to expand...
 
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