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New Ipad app FlyQ EFB by AOPA - I found my solution

Bugsy

Well Known Member
Just saw this new App discussed in Aviation consumer and it was love at first sight. Will also likely provide my backup ADI solution. It's at version 1.0.0 so I'm sure that there are glitches, but if it starts out this good, I'm sold. Thoughts are welcomed.

All the standard stuff we expect including $99 annual fee
- Clear graphics, sectionals and charts
- Geo reference charts and Airport Diagram
- Double click on airport for info

The deal maker:
Integrated EFIS Support, other apps have this as well, but this sol'n seems nicely integrated. The ILevil AHRS, sold from another company, provides wireless AHRS, ADBS-B and GPS.

ILevil SW $1,195 - GPS derived AHRS, WAAS GPS, ADS-B in, Solar charger
ILevil AW $1,395 - Pitot/static input, AHRS, WAAS GPS, ADS-B in
ILevil Plus $1,995 - All the above and support for engine monitoring

My plan, instead of the Dynon D1 backup ADI for $1400 and some other solution for ADS-B. Ill get the Ilevil AW, have integrated pitot static on an ADI/moving map with weather using FLYQ that I can move anywhere on the panel with and without Passengers, Includes ADSB and a GPS for the same price. Now if it supports more than one wireless connection (doubtful) I can have multiple displays with my IPAD and my IPAD mini.
 
IPAD Panel ?

Im 2-3 years from avionics. At this rate, all I will need is a couple of ipads on the panel. Sounds good.
 
It would be really good however only if they build a Ipad you can actually see in direct sunlight. Both the Ipad 2 and 3 are impossible to see in my cockpit with sunglasses on. Take the glasses off and they are marginal at best. If I remove the Ipad from the panal mount and place it on the seat where I can try and shade it then it gets better but its not a real solution.

George
 
Im 2-3 years from avionics. At this rate, all I will need is a couple of ipads on the panel. Sounds good.

I'm in the same boat. I figure society will be on to the "next big thing" in consumer electronics and we'll be looking at solutions with heads up displays using holographic technologies, by then.
 
Funny you should suggest this... I just spent a week modeling a new panel layout for Tweety in SolidWorks, and after moving displays from Dynon, GRT, and MGL around virtually, I asked myself, why can't I use the display I already have?

I've known about Levil's products, but it appears they are now becoming full featured enough that this makes more sense to me than a proprietary, integrated unit.
 
Did you consider WingX Pro? It has been around a while and does everything FlyQ does plus more. It support the iLevil too. You can try it free for 30 days and decide which one you like best.
 
I tried wing x pro and to me this new AOPA app just seems more intuitive.

Valid comment on the sun glare, but we all still bring our ipad along. In direct sunlight my primary ADI is right outside the window, so it's a map when sunny, backup ADI at night or IFR. And I still get the ADSB included.
 
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It would be really good however only if they build a Ipad you can actually see in direct sunlight. Both the Ipad 2 and 3 are impossible to see in my cockpit with sunglasses on. Take the glasses off and they are marginal at best. If I remove the Ipad from the panal mount and place it on the seat where I can try and shade it then it gets better but its not a real solution.

George

Perhaps that's a good excuse to build a Glasstar, or some other high-wing? :)
 
It would be really good however only if they build a Ipad you can actually see in direct sunlight. Both the Ipad 2 and 3 are impossible to see in my cockpit with sunglasses on. Take the glasses off and they are marginal at best. If I remove the Ipad from the panal mount and place it on the seat where I can try and shade it then it gets better but its not a real solution.

George

Yes, but in 2-3 years I bet IPAD will have a better screen.
 
Yes, but in 2-3 years I bet IPAD will have a better screen.
If so, that would be great. However, given my current experience with the iPad there is absolutely no way I would rely on the iPad as any form of primary flight display today. There are too many times when flying with my iPad gen3 that I flat out cannot make out what it is displaying due to the glare and lack of brightness. Both are substantial problems Apple needs to overcome before I could ever consider the iPad as a primary screen in any aviation operation.

My .02.
 
PLEASE pay attention to George and Steve.

I am 100% in favor of using iPad in the cockpit for information, but I would never think of it as a primary display. It isn't bright enough. It is subject to heat failure and is not rated to work at high altitude.

I display map information and airport information with mine, but if it goes blank it doesn't bother me as I just look outside the window (VFR).

Don't expect Apple to work on making the iPad much brighter. They sale millions of these thing and less than 1% will be used for aviation. There will be little incentive for the kind of screen brightness we need in our panels.

Good luck with our builds.

Kent
 
Perhaps that's a good excuse to build a Glasstar, or some other high-wing? :)

34852826.jpg
 
If so, that would be great. However, given my current experience with the iPad there is absolutely no way I would rely on the iPad as any form of primary flight display today. There are too many times when flying with my iPad gen3 that I flat out cannot make out what it is displaying due to the glare and lack of brightness. Both are substantial problems Apple needs to overcome before I could ever consider the iPad as a primary screen in any aviation operation.

I really have to get flying with my iPad handy more often and do more testing, I guess... I've had the iPad up before, and had *no* issues with readability. If there was sun glare, a 2 degree tilt was enough to shed the glare and return visibility. In sharp contrast, my Garmin Area, designed for cockpits and pilots, is almost invisible, and yet I rely on it as my primary navigation tool... With paper maps as backup.

In the cockpit where I have power available, I keep the brightness cranked up. Maybe that is the reason visibility isn't an issue?
 
I really have to get flying with my iPad handy more often and do more testing, I guess... I've had the iPad up before, and had *no* issues with readability. If there was sun glare, a 2 degree tilt was enough to shed the glare and return visibility. In sharp contrast, my Garmin Area, designed for cockpits and pilots, is almost invisible, and yet I rely on it as my primary navigation tool... With paper maps as backup.

In the cockpit where I have power available, I keep the brightness cranked up. Maybe that is the reason visibility isn't an issue?
I have the brightness level on the iPad cranked to full brightness. It is functional ONLY if one can move the iPad around to avoid any direct sunlight. This is how I am sure many are getting by with using the iPad in the cockpit. It is how I am able to make it functional. However, if one were to permanently mount the iPad in a panel one would quickly discover its display limitations.

This is why I made the comment about not using it as a primary flight display. A primary flight display should be an integral component of the airplane. I cannot fathom a mobile piece of hardware used as such. I also think that having to go through any type of manipulation just to be able to see what is on the display is not a good design for any primary display.

Just to be clear, I love the iPad and Foreflight. . . for flight planning and for examining weather there is nothing better! I use it on every cross country flight. It is fantastic for that functionality. I even have it on a RAM mount and use it as a secondary GPS while in flight. However, the display limits it to the secondary role. If it had a more dependably viewable display the possibility might exist to convert it to a primary display as has been suggested on this and other threads. Since it does have display limits it will not be making that transition in my cockpit though.
 
Steve, what do you think the issue is, primarily? Is it a lack of brightness (even when cranked up to the max), or is it the glossy screen?

As I say, I found my iPad to be quite bright enough in flight. It's the angle that sometimes gets me, and i've wondered if it would make sense to get a matte-finish screen protector for it to cut the glare. Or maybe there's a glare-reducing non-matte finish protector... I haven't looked at what's out there.

On my Aera, i'm certain that there are two fundamental flaws... One is the overall lack of brightness, even when cranked to the max it's not even half as bright as my iPad. Two is the resistive touchscreen, which adds so many layers between the screen itself and the outside of the display (resistive layers, air gaps, durable matte-finish screen protector, etc) that what little brightness it had is quickly destroyed. Garmin could corner the handheld market if they put a capacitive touchscreen in the Aera and tripled the brightness.
 
I love my ipad and use it every time i fly. I have a glare shield on my v3 mounted to a ram mount. I rarely have issues being able to read it easily. That said, it's still not as bright as I'd like.
 
I use an iPad in my 6

I'm with Kent, I love the iPad. I use it all the time in my 6. I have a permanent mount on the right side. I use it for information, airport, weather, flight planning and it's great. As a primary flight instrument? NO! It is just not up to the task. Not meant to be and likely will not be in the future.
 
Backup?

If your ipad could display pitot/static air data onto an EFIS would you use it as a backup system instead of a competitively priced dynon D1 that is brighter but relies on GPS derived data instead of measured?
 
If your ipad could display pitot/static air data onto an EFIS would you use it as a backup system instead of a competitively priced dynon D1 that is brighter but relies on GPS derived data instead of measured?


I'm not sure what failure are you attempting to protect?

Also, I don't understand why you would ever want to display date off an iPad to an EFIS. I can see the reverse, using an iPad as an EFIS backup in a VFR aircraft.

If you are attempting to cover an EFIS failure, another EFIS would most likely be a better solution, since you would already have pitot/static lines plummed into the backup. I wouldn't want to deal with primary instrumentation on an iPad in IMC.

The only way to protect the pitot/static lines are to install dual pitots (i.e one on each wing) and an alternative static port (i.e. in the cockpit).
 
Steve, what do you think the issue is, primarily? Is it a lack of brightness (even when cranked up to the max), or is it the glossy screen?

As I say, I found my iPad to be quite bright enough in flight. It's the angle that sometimes gets me, and i've wondered if it would make sense to get a matte-finish screen protector for it to cut the glare. Or maybe there's a glare-reducing non-matte finish protector... I haven't looked at what's out there.

On my Aera, i'm certain that there are two fundamental flaws... One is the overall lack of brightness, even when cranked to the max it's not even half as bright as my iPad. Two is the resistive touchscreen, which adds so many layers between the screen itself and the outside of the display (resistive layers, air gaps, durable matte-finish screen protector, etc) that what little brightness it had is quickly destroyed. Garmin could corner the handheld market if they put a capacitive touchscreen in the Aera and tripled the brightness.
Rob, sorry for the delay in replying to your post. I have not been on the forum for about a week now and have not followed this thread for a bit longer than that. To answer your question, although the brightness is the prominent shortcoming there are others as well. As for the brightness, it is a deal killer for sure. As I have posted previously I am hooked on the iPad for its functionality but not for its reliability. Mounting it and then relying on it to provide me the data I need without fail is not going to happen. I have experienced all sorts of "data loss" issues while flying with it in the cockpit. Glare and unreadable screens is a "data loss" issue when you absolutely need to have that data but cannot read it without contorting either your eye or the instrument.

Every time I read about the iPad screen brightness issue it reminds me of an experience I had years ago with a Microsoft Flight Sim X airplane program I downloaded from AOPA. Several years ago when AOPA was giving away a Cessna Cardinal for their yearly promotion, they had a Flight Sim download that allowed you to fly their Cardinal on the simulator. So I downloaded it. It actually was pretty nice except for one particular quirk that I never was able to fix. If I flew in severe clear conditions on the simulator and turned the airplane so that the sunlight was beaming in onto the instrument panel all of the instruments (they were round dial old school instruments) would turn completely black and no information was displayed at all on them. At the time I was flying the simulator trying to get the feel of flying with instruments. Well, as long as the sun was beaming in on the panel there was no instrument flying going to occur for sure. I never was able to adjust any of the settings to change this behavior. I finally gave up on flying that airplane in the simulator.

I have experienced that behavior first hand with the iPad but that is not the only problems I have experienced. I have had the iPad lose the GPS signal multiple times, I have had the Foreflight app lock up and the only thing that would resolve it was a reboot of the iPad. I have had the 'pinching' functionality of the iPad send the data on the screen into a super close-up mode to the point where I had no reference to where I was on the moving map display because it had blown up the view to the scale of a few feet instead of a few miles because my hand was bumped around just as I was touching the screen.

So between the screen readability issues in sunlight, the 'too touchy' touch screen and the instability of the apps and/or operating system in a dynamic environment such as a bumpy cockpit I do not have confidence the iPad could ever serve in its current configuration as a primary flight tool. I have not even discussed the temperature range issues that can be a problem too.

My GRT HX displays cost a lot more than the iPad for sure, but, there is NO COMPARISON between the stability and reliability of the HX to the iPad. The same holds true for my Garmin 695 GPS. Both of those units when held in direct sunlight facing up to the sun can be easily viewed without squinting, tilting or any contorting what so ever. They are rock solid instruments. The iPad, not so much.

what do you think the issue is, primarily? Is it a lack of brightness (even when cranked up to the max), or is it the glossy screen?
To answer these questions specifically, it is both. I have used the anti-glare sheilds that are sold. I could see very little, if any, decrease in glare. What I did notice was a distortion of the clarity of the display. Why buy a device with an incredible high resolution display only to put a fuzzy thick sheet of plastic over the screen that will distort the view? After less than a week of trying this the plastic film came off. The glare is very bad but the fuzzy quality of looking through the plastic was worse. The brightness is also just as detrimental. I would bet everything I own that the Apple designers developed the current brightness level because they had to compromise that in order to achieve a longer battery life. I am sure they were much more concerned about the problems of being able to have that longer operation time than they were of users taking the device out into bright sunlight and using it. After all, really how often do geeks even look up from their computer screens, let alone step out into direct sunlight. Ok, just kidding. That was a joke. But seriously, they were designing a revolutionary product that really has changed the world. It was inevitable that some compromises had to be made.
 
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... we'll be looking at solutions with heads up displays using holographic technologies, by then.

Google Glasses+ ? Actually I wonder, when Google Glasses really get into production, will someone make a flight/navigation app for them.
 
Any recent reviews???

Hi All,

I just downloaded the FlyQ EFB for tryout and am pretty impressed. I've not flown with it yet as I'm just trying to learn the system.

I have ForeFlight and love it; but would sure like to hear what anyone else is thinking about these dandy tools. What are your observations?? Likes & dislikes??

I know they are all so close & wonderful. I think the 3D is nice; but as a practical matter, how much does is help. My G-496 is my most trusted tool.

Really appreciate any input.

Cheers,
 
On the subject of glare...

Few, if any, cars have their displays out in the sun. If you're still building, how deeply can you recess a display into the panel & still be able to reach it comfortably? That might solve both the glare & brightness issues, if you can still reach it.

Trusting Apple to not push an update while flying an approach is another matter....:)

Charlie
 
Apple doesn't push updates. They notify you that an update is available and you then choose when to load the update. I know your kidding Charlie.

All of our electronic gear is susceptible to lightning, static, errant electrons etc.

Keep paper and a compass on hand if you want

I think having a portable system that isn't on the buss adds safety. If you keep your gadget plugged in all the time you might negate that safety margin.
 
Really !!!?!!!

Well, I've got some real weather going on now & I'm switching back & forth between ForeFlight & FlyQ. Think I'm going to stay with FF. One reason is I'm just more familiar with it. But I like its features. I'm strictly day VFR & don't need 3D. ...yeah, staying with FF.

Fun to play with the programs. :D

Cheers,
 
Ipad in the cockpit

Yes, there is glare. Yes, it is not bright enough. But it does the job very nicely for a very reasonable price. The aircraft is day/night VFR. The MGL EFIS is primarily used as a EMS, but can display GPS generated EFIS information as a backup.

 
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