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Gray haired RV owners....

pierre smith

pierre smith

Well Known Member
...seem to be the norm but yesterday, I had a real surprise. A young guy from central Georgia was on the way to look at my -6A but stopped by Kaolin Aviation to speak with my buddy, Ray Lawrence at his builder assist center.

Ray asked his age and he said that he was 24. Ray asked what he did for a living to be able to buy a $70,000 airplane. "I race motocross" dirt bikes. Ray remarked that he must have a pretty good sponsor. "I do...Yamaha factory!!"

Amazing,
 
What young people lack

I am 31, and I think I can afford to slowly build my RV. I am a proffesional, married to a proffesional and we have no kids. The difference between us and the other similar couples I know is this, we still remember how to be cheap. We don't have a McMansion, we don't have overly expensive cars, we don't eat out alot, we don't rush out and buy the latest electronic gadget, and we would die before we paid somebody to do something we can do ourselves.

If anything we are overly conservative when it comes to finances because we both grew up in "paycheck to paycheck" homes and both survived layoffs multiple times early in our careers.
 
Different situations I guess

When I was 24 I remember trying to find enough soda bottles to turn in for deposit to complete a dollar to take the family to a drive-in theater for $1 a car load. But, it wasn't so bad - I had a car. Sometimes things that come hard are appreciated more.

Bob Axsom
 
engineerorange said:
I am 31, and I think I can afford to slowly build my RV. I am a proffesional, married to a proffesional and we have no kids. The difference between us and the other similar couples I know is this, we still remember how to be cheap. We don't have a McMansion, we don't have overly expensive cars, we don't eat out alot, we don't rush out and buy the latest electronic gadget, and we would die before we paid somebody to do something we can do ourselves.

If anything we are overly conservative when it comes to finances because we both grew up in "paycheck to paycheck" homes and both survived layoffs multiple times early in our careers.
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Sounds like the Dave Ramsey method. "Live like no one else so later you can live like no one else." Maybe this is why I have taken 10 or so years on my tail and still looking for wings one of these days.
 
Factory racers make a good living -- they are essentially star athletes. One of my sons used to work for the Kawasaki factory team, and their top racers pull down more money than many white color professionals. More power to them!

pierre smith said:
Ray asked his age and he said that he was 24. Ray asked what he did for a living to be able to buy a $70,000 airplane. "I race motocross" dirt bikes. Ray remarked that he must have a pretty good sponsor. "I do...Yamaha factory!!"
Click to expand...
 
I'm 25 and just started my RV-8. Wife and I both work and play hard. We are frugal at home - she is going to grad school, I am building an airplane... hopefully with no debt in sight. If anyone is a Dave Ramsey fan, you'll understand... ;)

We'll see how the "real world" likes our idea. I'm confident thus far.
 
Dave Ramsey fan

I think it should be a required class for high school. I have both of my 40 yr old children doing the program so one of them can afford my 7a when I am gone.
 
re: Dave Ramsey...

Agreed - today's younger generation has no clue about the heartburn they are about to experience, and it's creating an entire generation of people who depend on entitlement programs. I promised myself when I started this project that I would not borrow money to finish it, and every piece so far has been paid for with cash. If I want it bad enough, I will find a way to get the cash. If I can't get the cash, that simply means I didn't want it badly enough. You don't buy what you can't afford.
 
Medical Insurance

RVnoob said:
I am going to take up motorcross as a hobby.


:)>
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Just make sure you have great medical insurance:eek: As a medical helicopter pilot this is often a call we get, pick up a motocross rider at one of the many tracks we have in the Phoenix area. One of helicopters near one of the bigger tracks made 3 trips to the track in one evening. Ouch!!!
 
I'm 37 (with grey hairs!) but when I joined the local chapter of the RAA (Recreational Aircraft Association in Canada, EAA doesn't seem to be that active here aside from Young Eagles) I appear to be the youngest in the group.

I'm not sure yet how I'll pay for my -9A but I'm also a working professional (business analyst with a twist of software development ;) ) and I'm single with no kids. I too have never lived an extravagent lifestyle. A simple bungalow that will be paid off in 5 years. (yay!) No fancy car and I take the bus to/from work. Most of my cash has been thrown into retirement savings but I can certainly divert some cash to the build. I'll find a way to make it happen.

Cheers,
 
Dave Ramsey has it right. I wish I had figured it out sooner. We're trying to sell the house to move to a small house or apartment and are accelerating debt payoff. It will take a while but will be worth it. My wife is not completely on board yet but I am determined to once again be debt free.

Taxes and the economy worry me a lot right now, especially since I missed three months work early in the year. I'll worry less when my expenses are way lower.
 
Yep another big Dave Ramesy fan here my wife and I live on less than we make;) It was really cool we even called in and yelled "we are debt free!!!!!"
 
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debt

There was an interesting bio-documentary on Warren Buffet on the Beeb recently. A most interesting quote from him regarding debt/leverage was:

"Those who are smart enough shouldn't need it and those who aren't have no business to be using it."

I'm 39 now. My -8 might even fly before I'm 50, with my own engine design, hopefully... ;)
 
Some pay interest, some collect interest: which one do you want to be?

While I'm often against people going in debt, I'm not as radical as Ramsey. I believe that, in some situation, it makes sense to borrow money. Most people could easily manage their personal finances if they were taught a few principles.
 
My hair is not gray! It is silver.

Oh wait, if I claim that, I'll have to change my nick name to SilverHawk. :p
 
29 and just getting started. Been flying professionally since I was 20, and in the years it took me to finally start making decent money, I learned how to live well within my means.
 
I started at 28. I gave my self a gift (tail kit) after graduating from test pilot school. I am 33 now and hope to have my plane flying soon. The point for me is not to live outside my means. I did not by a house I could not afford, I don't have a new car, I paid all my school loans, I only have one credit card, I don't buy redbull or starbuck drinks, I don't buy stuff because it just came out and I have to have it and I don't go out to eat much (I eat a lot of left overs). I do all those things because I want an RV. I am very lucky that my wife and I are on the same page.

It is about making sacrifices in order to obtain the things that matter most to my wife and I.
 
Aged RV'rs

The usual reason for the prevalance of the Gray Patrol in RV'ers is the younger entusiasts have family and other requirements upon their time. After a few years we're not required in the home/other as much. We can instead be out in the garage or at the airport building away, without starting a war. And what better way to spend one"s time??:)
 
.... everything started in 1988 when I was 24 (totally black hair); that year the italian magazine “Volare” issued an article where an engineer provided drawings and a rough kit for the costruction of an amazing single seat , conventional gear, low wing and bubble canopy. The picture showed a pilot flying over a typical Oregon farm. I was a student pilot and I remember I literally devoured that article about the RV3. I searched for the constructor’s address and asked for a fax about the available kits. Such a project was unthinkable (no gray hair, not enough money) for me at the time, but everything was clearly impressed on my mind. In 1989 I got my license. Some years later, in 1997, a trip to the US took me to the Sun & Fun in Florida, where I had the opportunity of flying an RV-4 at Pompano Airport. RV-8 kit was being showcased at Van’s Aircraft Inc.’s stand: the sporting features of that aircraft light-struck me. Patience (to save money) is one of my virtues, and here I am, almost ready for first flight for next spring. Some gray hairs easily visible.
 
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31 and not started yet...

I'm 31 and from a country where fiscal conservatism among the middle-class is well known. (We are the people who bargain at garage sales ;) )

I have a nice income, a wife who is a professional, no kids yet, a townhouse that is more than enough for the two of us and which we bought only because the monthly payment worked out to be cheaper than many apartments in this area (and because I needed a garage to start working on my RV), one car which we share and no debt other than the mortgage.

We also don't drink, party, eat out a lot or in expensive places. I have some investments that have done well despite the recession and a fairly good stash of cash. Our one vice is that we both love to fly and spend a bit on renting from the club.

All that said, I'm still leary of pulling the trigger and start on the RV build. I think there's conservative and there's fear of commitment and I'm not quite sure which one describes me better :D
 
Hear this..

skyflies said:
.

All that said, I'm still leary of pulling the trigger and start on the RV build. I think there's conservative and there's fear of commitment and I'm not quite sure which one describes me better :D
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Hi YK,

I can assure you that there are more guys on here that wished they'd started much, much earlier than they did, me included. I built my Cassutt in 1974
when I was 29 and never looked back.

There are no gaurantees that you'll see tomorrow, my friend.

Regards,
 
Paul Thomas said:
While I'm often against people going in debt, I'm not as radical as Ramsey. I believe that, in some situation, it makes sense to borrow money. Most people could easily manage their personal finances if they were taught a few principles.
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I just wish people would understand they need to pay back the money they borrow. In today's world that it is becoming more and more difficult to find people who understand that "old fashioned concept". :cool:
 
Motocross

RV7Guy said:
Just make sure you have great medical insurance:eek: As a medical helicopter pilot this is often a call we get, pick up a motocross rider at one of the many tracks we have in the Phoenix area. One of helicopters near one of the bigger tracks made 3 trips to the track in one evening. Ouch!!!
Click to expand...
Totally agree with this. I used to race motocross in the late 70s and early 80s and then again in the early 90s (what was I thinking? :eek:) and the risk of what the magazines euphemistically call "getting hurt" (paralysis) caused me to quit. It's a great sport, but just too dangerous for me.

Flying fills the void somewhat, but the competition is missing. I hope if I ever finish my 8 that I can do some air racing. Won't be quite the same as banging bars, but I'm sure the adrenaline will flow.
 
By the summer of 1982, I was 26, had been an engineer for 3 years (and a private pilot for 5), and had $10K accumulated from overtime in the aerospace/defense boom going on at the time. I was still single and my only debt was a small mortgage (seemed like a better idea than rent;)). The idea of building an airplane has always appealed to me, but at that time I wanted to fly worse than I wanted to build, so I bought the C-170B I still have 27+ years later. (Wow, it just occurred to me that I've had that thing more than half my life!) I'm not as fiscally conservative as some, but did manage to buy the Cessna and keep it maintained without borrowing against it.

I lucked out and bought my current house at the right time, and have managed to stay right-side-up on it through the current economy. I do borrow for new cars, but I've managed to keep each one 12 years or so (54 years old, and 1 year into only my 3rd new car ever), and keep the credit cards paid off every month. My aim is to build my Rocket (or RV) airframe on a pay-as-you-go basis. By the time the the really big ticket items come due, I figure the Cessna goes on the block. That should net enough for an engine, plus some. About that same time my youngest will finish college (two college educations w/o borrowing - whew!) which should free up budget for the rest. Barring catastrophe, by the time I retire I should have a nice fast x-country machine all paid for, and a mortgage down in the short rows.:cool: The biggest challenge now is to stay healthy enough to be able to enjoy it!
 
Feeling really old!

I started building when I was 50, 53 now, and looks like I may be 56 or 57 before I finish. I agree with those who pay as you go. No way will I barrow money or use any savings or retirement to pay for the RV.

It's not happening as fast as I thought it would but two kids through private college and one in the USAFA takes it toll. Not to mention this little recession we are in! Any way, It would have been nice to start younger but, priorities......

Build on.
 
hopefully starting real soon.

I'm currently 33 and should be pulling the trigger on a -4 tail kit after the first of the year. My wife is onboard with the project and we're planning a slow pay as you go build. We also don't have any kids right now, just dogs. I've been wanting to get started on building for the last 10 years, but trying to get my flying career underway took the front seat. I'm as settled as possible now, so it's time to make metal fly.
 
add another young guy

I bought my RV when I was 23. I was flying for a small company, debt was really low and income was good. Most folks, including the family all thought it was a terrible idea and that I would never be able to afford it. I always said its about choices. I choose to not drive a brand new car, buy new clothes every week - I've been wearing the same blue jeans since high school...yes, they've been washed ;), and I don't eat out every night. What surprises folks when they find out I own my own plane is that most of them pay more for the car they drive everyday than I do for my plane!

The best part about being so young with the plane is the oportunity to get other young guys into flying. Its way cool to see the surprise on their faces when they see that the plane belongs to sombody just like them. Its the "well if he can do it, so can I!" look...and that is better than the perfect slow roll. And this of course is the perfect time to ask if they'd like to go try it out...:D

As all of you here know, it starts with a dream. The RV dream for me started back in High School, so I laid out a plan and stuck to it - with a few exceptions :rolleyes: - but thats another story. It took a little more than 3 years to get here, but anything worth having is worth working for right? :)
 
Also here but.....

KirkGrovesRV8 said:
Yep another big Dave Ramesy fan here
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Found Aviation and AIDS (Aviation induced divorced syndrome) at 31, Purchased a 172 in OSH during Airventure at 32, With a little cash and a credit card ($9,000 for a 172!) I began a new life of adventure. Dave Ramesy yes, But that 172 changed my life. It was the best money I ever borrowed!
 
Wish

Wish I started earler. I bought my Bonanza P35, @ 41 years young. Put 800 hours on it. Trinidad to California, attended 2 Reno Races, lots of going to OSH.
I started flying in my 30s, but wanted to fly since I could make a sentence.

IF I could change anything,, STARTING FLYING EARLER IN LIFE, WOULD BE IT.

I have over 4000 hours in my log book, 2200+ in RVs. I have not had a flying job. Just that my life revolves around airplanes and flying them now. Dinner migh be flying to eat. Lunch with Doogie @ the Blue Hanger.

Most all friends are aircraft owners and like minded. We eat, breath, and plan our activities around flying. Life is the best, and long distance.

Thanks to aviation I have met the great people. Could not have done it with out you.

Thanks
Jay
 
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So, a young 24 year old factory Yamaha racer... I should be able to recall who this is in my mind!
I've been racing Motocross for 3 years now (no major injuries, for some reason I bounce!) and I'm positive that with the money I have put into it ($5000 bike, close to $1000 a month to afford the racing) I could have already built my RV-4.
Now, the bike is getting a bit old for racing as the technology has really advanced in 4 years, and I would love to spend the $10gs for a new one, but that is almost a complete airframe kit.
When I start my build, I will be single, no kids, and the only debt I will have every month will be a mortgage and bills that come alone with that... luckily I eat healthy on close to $100 a month in groceries, and can be cheap when I want something! Heck, the only reason why I'm moving out of the barracks (rent is $120 a month!) is because I think everyone is tired of my vehicles (truck, trailer and street bike) taking up parking spots, and I need a garage for my project... I could care less about the house!
Plus, think of the dates you could have with a nice cute young lady, I bet that will be a first for her!
 
A lot of great personal stories here! Remember, it's never too late to chase after your dreams.

Cheers. :)
 
Glider License at 16.
Private License at 17.
Commercial License at 18.
Tow Pilot/Glider Instructor at 18.
Went north for the float flying industry at 18.
Tow Pilot/Glider Instructor in New Zealand at 19.
Found better money in the cropdusting industry at 19.
Purchased my -8 Tail kit at 21.

Even though the ride has just begun....it's been one heck of a ride so far! I'm still in the cropdusting industry since 19 and loving it.
 
I was in the Canadian Air Cadet programme. I won scholarships to get my glider license when I was 16, and my power license when I was 17. Unfortunately, towards teh very end of my power license (about 10 hours to go) I was involved in a very bad car accident (as a passenger) - suffered a serious head injury, fractured neck, and was comatose for a few days. Obviously my aviation medical was revoked for a couple of years. My dream had always been to be a fighter pilot, but i had to give that up obviously. I turned to other thigns, got my degree in engineering, master's in mathematics and PhD in computer science. I basically forgot all about flying for many, many years. It wasn't until i was about 29, when i moved to Ottawa to work for the federal government, that I came back to flying. I lived by the airport, and often saw the Katanas taking off. So I decided to finish my license, and decided to build an RV shortly after. Been building for 3 years, and have used a line-of-credit, but don't regret that at all... with a 100K/yr secure government job, and currently low interest rates, I'm quite confident that paying the debt will not be a problem. I also built a hangar last year, which definately required the line of credit.
Almost 34 years old now, a baby girl at home, and the RV is almost finished. All in all, life is great, and building the RV has a lot to do with that. I don't second-guess my decision to finance the hangar and part of hte plane at all. It'll be paid off in a few years.
The only bad thing about getting back into flying is that I now often regret deeply that my dream of being a fighter pilot was destroyed. Recently I discovered that a guy I leanred to fly gliders with when we were 16 (Jeremy Hanson), was a fighter pilot and is now a new Canadian astronaut... and I can't help but be really jealous and wonder what could have been in store for me if the accident hand't killed my dream so long ago.
 
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Its insteresting the tie between flying dirt and street bikes. Like many others I used to race moto X and still do heavy trail riding today. I was 27 when I started my 4. At that time my wife and I didnt have a pot to P in. Like others we lived very frugal. (you have to pick your priorities) I bought my tail kit and put it together while saving for the wing kit. Same for the fuselage and finish kits. It took me 4.5 years but I managed to get it done. I had reserved N number 131RB the 1 for my first homebuilt 31 for the age I thought I would finish and RB of course first and last name. I was slightly off as I finished at an early 32. I can remember several of Vans banquets where I was definatly the youngest one in attendance. Today I dont have as much hair as I used to and its just starting to show signs of gray its hard to believe how fast it goes by. I have had 15 fantastic years with my 4 and still love it.
Ryan
4 flying
Rocket in progress!!
 
Wish I had more gray hair...

Quite a few years back, my hair started turning gray.
Then it started turning loose...:eek:
 
I've raced MX a good bit too, but sadly never got good enough at it to get paid for my efforts. Fantastic fun though and congrats to the Yamaha rider! I've found MX to be amazingly afordable if one wants it to be (and doesn't need to be ultra-competitive at the professional level). A $2k dollar bike is much faster than I am and about $100 will cover gas and fees for a day of racing - in certain areas practice is even cheaper, most of the tracks around Denver are in the $10/day range and the bike isn't terriably expensive to maintain (I do all my own work of course). I'm also on the younger side (27), but don't have an RV yet. I've wanted to fly regularly for as long as I can remember but haven't been able to afford it yet. Paid my way though college working as an auto mechanic, got to do a little glider flying when attending an honors program at Oxford (they have planes and free instructors, all I had to pay was 3lbs to the RAF for a winch launch) but then went to work as an economist for a non-profit. Great learning experience, but lousy pay.

I'm now in my final year of law school and have a job lined up to start after the bar next fall that should enable lots of flying and an RV purchase or build sometime before I'm terribly far into my 30's. Untill then I'll get my fix by bumming rides off kind souls, FSX and flying my MX bike. I also tour on street bikes (its usually how I get to Oshkosh) and ride mtb's.

"flying" the CR
 
Shoot Pierre, based on the title of this thread, I thought you might have been at the fly-in I went to today! :eek::D
 
Another over the hill Moto X 'er here

The older I get, the faster I was!

So I was pretty danged fast! :D

Me & the misses just got back from a day road trip on the Ultra-Classic. Different era... but still enjoying bikes. I think this is my 11th or 12th. We have another trip planned tomorrow.
 
RBD said:
Ahhhh, the good times I've had at Hard Rock. Long ways from Denver.
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Hardrock is a good track. My parents live in south FL and I drove down from DC to meet them there a while ago. I don't have a steady place of residence (work is in DC, school in Cambridge and friends/fun and previous work in Denver)


Here's a Denver track (IMI)
DSC00545.JPG


Colorado trail riding/goofing off at 12k feet
Ride19.jpg


Ride7.jpg


And when I was in DC area I raced AMA D-7, Budd's Creek was my favorite track on the circuit.


And on occasion we made a run down to Hangtime in SC (sadly no longer open)
 
Yeah...

RBD said:
Shoot Pierre, based on the title of this thread, I thought you might have been at the fly-in I went to today! :eek::D
Click to expand...

....and just wait 'til our Ag aviation convention in 'Vegas this December...more gray hairs still....and a bunch of RV pilots there too.

Regards,
 
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