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  #1  
Old 06-30-2020, 08:01 AM
Jeffcc17 Jeffcc17 is offline
 
Join Date: Oct 2019
Location: Charleston SC
Posts: 4
Default Need Advice on Priming

Hello,

I just ordered my RV-10 Tail kit. I live on a salt marsh in South Carolina. What are your recommendations about priming? In 5 years I plan on moving to the Denver area but I am sure the aircraft will come back to SC every once and a while.
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  #2  
Old 06-30-2020, 08:07 AM
iwannarv iwannarv is offline
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Olathe, KS
Posts: 359
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I used Akzo Nobel 2 Part Epoxy primer. Great stuff, but pretty nasty to work with, so spend some time getting a proper paint booth/air system set up. I'm Kansas based but want to fly to the coasts/Caribbean at some point so I decided to prime, plus I'm fairly young and want airframe longevity. Wings are QB so they just have a wash primer.

If I were nearing retirement age and were generally a central US traveler investing in an RV10 - I'd still prime, but probably use wash primer like all Vans QB kits and call it good enough.
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  #3  
Old 06-30-2020, 09:24 AM
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wirejock wirejock is offline
 
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Location: Estes Park, CO
Posts: 3,767
Default P60G2

I believe Vans sample is over 17 years outside. P60G2 is really light and easy to spray. Of course, the standard precautions apply.
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  #4  
Old 06-30-2020, 09:26 AM
hillc95 hillc95 is offline
 
Join Date: May 2014
Location: Jacksonville, FL
Posts: 37
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I went the other end of the spectrum...I scuff the parts with a scotch brite pad, clean with acetone and cover with Rust-oleum Self Etching spray primer.....bout $5 a can at Lowe's.... Nowhere near as nice as the Akzo but it gets the job done with minimal prep/cost and still looks decent....for the record I am in coastal GA...
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  #5  
Old 06-30-2020, 10:50 AM
Jeffcc17 Jeffcc17 is offline
 
Join Date: Oct 2019
Location: Charleston SC
Posts: 4
Default a follow up

It sounds like consensus is to prime. does anyone know of a thread that covers priming for newbies like myself. What kind of gun and set up do you need? I have a pretty good air compressor and have a reel in the garage. Dryers??? Lots of questions.

Thank you for your help

Jeff
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  #6  
Old 06-30-2020, 11:13 AM
jacoby jacoby is offline
 
Join Date: Jul 2018
Location: WNC
Posts: 215
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeffcc17 View Post
It sounds like consensus is to prime. does anyone know of a thread that covers priming for newbies like myself. What kind of gun and set up do you need? I have a pretty good air compressor and have a reel in the garage. Dryers??? Lots of questions.

Thank you for your help

Jeff
Big thing is your air compressor. HVLP guns like to use a lot of air. A little "1 hp" job site compressor won't be up to the task. You can do most/all of the primer with something around 3hp with at least a 30 gal tank and something around 5+ CFM @ 90 psi. You'll have to wait at times for it to catch up but it'll do what you need.

The gun? $10 HF "purple" gun. Don't buy a nice gun. Buy a couple of the purple guns and throw them away if you get tired of cleaning. If you want to conserve a bit of primer for the smaller stuff, grab a touch up gun as well. They use a lot less air but are more like an oversized air brush than a spray gun.

You will need mixing cups and filters and stir sticks. And (real!) MEK for cleanup.

Drying the air? Really depends on your set up and your environment. I have an inline air trap that works well enough but we have relatively low humidity here.

PPE? Really depends on where you are spraying and what your comfort level is. A minimum for spraying outdoors is an organic-rated respirator, nitrile gloves, and goggles. Tyvek suits are cheap and are well worth it if you are going to be in an enclosed space or want to be extra cautious. The chemicals in epoxy coatings are pretty nasty.

You also need to decide on prep for the primer (assuming the Azko): scrub w/ bon ami, scrub w/ alumi prep, or alodine.

Optional but nice? Swap out the standard pot for the 3M PPS system (or do the whole PPS gun if you have the cash to spend) and get rid of the need for mixing pots and filters.

The azko is pretty forgiving to spray. Do a light coat at about 8" off the work to get a consistent opaque green and you will be to spec (2 mil dry film IIRC). It'll flow out as long as you aren't too far away. You want a slightly compressed fan so you don't get a ton of dry overspray and do about 1/4-1/3 overlap.
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  #7  
Old 06-30-2020, 11:16 AM
tims88 tims88 is offline
 
Join Date: Jul 2016
Location: Arvada, CO
Posts: 77
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While this isn't a direct answer to your questions, this is a good place to start for someone with lots of questions: http://www.vansairforce.com/communit....php?f-54.html

There's many years of forum threads discussing primer on that page. I like it compared to the normal list in the forum because it shows a lot more on one page so you don't have to click through as many pages. I'd recommend scrolling through it and reading anything that looks like it might be related to a question you have or a primer that might want to try. I've spent many hours doing that myself and it has been very helpful, although some times it just leads to more questions...
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  #8  
Old 06-30-2020, 12:25 PM
lr172 lr172 is offline
 
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: Schaumburg, IL
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jacoby View Post
PPE? Really depends on where you are spraying and what your comfort level is. A minimum for spraying outdoors is an organic-rated respirator, nitrile gloves, and goggles. Tyvek suits are cheap and are well worth it if you are going to be in an enclosed space or want to be extra cautious. The chemicals in epoxy coatings are pretty nasty.
respirators rated for organic solvents do NOT block or protect from isocyanates. That is the really nasty stuff in 2 part urethane clears/single stage and epoxy primers. organic solvents just give you headaches. Iso's cause serious health issues. You need a chemical rated respirator (even then the manufacturer says it doesn't protect from ISO's). FYI, isocyanates have no odor, so the fact that everything smells good is not an indication that the respirator is working.
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Last edited by lr172 : 06-30-2020 at 12:31 PM.
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  #9  
Old 06-30-2020, 01:11 PM
jacoby jacoby is offline
 
Join Date: Jul 2018
Location: WNC
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lr172 View Post
respirators rated for organic solvents do NOT block or protect from isocyanates. That is the really nasty stuff in 2 part urethane clears/single stage and epoxy primers. organic solvents just give you headaches. Iso's cause serious health issues. You need a chemical rated respirator (even then the manufacturer says it doesn't protect from ISO's). FYI, isocyanates have no odor, so the fact that everything smells good is not an indication that the respirator is working.
FWIW, I have gone through the SDS for the primer and curing solution and have not found any isocynates in the Akzo primer. I am not a chemist so it's very possible I've missed it.


I do agree that clear coats are a whole other ball of problems and issues. PPE requirements are FAR higher and require a lot more skill and equipment. You can do a very good job of priming in your back yard. You can do anywhere from just awful to merely bad spraying clear in the same environment!
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  #10  
Old 06-30-2020, 01:57 PM
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Ironflight Ironflight is offline
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Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Dayton, NV
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeffcc17 View Post
It sounds like consensus is to prime. does anyone know of a thread that covers priming for newbies like myself. What kind of gun and set up do you need? I have a pretty good air compressor and have a reel in the garage. Dryers??? Lots of questions.

Thank you for your help

Jeff
Consensus? Three posts in an hour?

Prime if you want to, don't prime if you don't. I have seen very, very few airplanes with internal corrosion problems in more than forty years of playing with light aircraft - certified and experimental. I am much more likely to find corrosion under external paint to be honest. I spent over thirty years on teh gulf coast, and saw unprimed Cessnaís with unprimed interiors with no corrosion in most cases. Yes, there are also examples of airplanes that were corroded beyond airworthiness, but usually they had a backstory about being flooded in a hurricane, or they landed in a salt marsh at some time.

In our fleet, we have both primed and unprimed interiors...but we now live in the high desert, so my experience from here on out isnít going to count for much....
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