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  #61  
Old 11-16-2019, 03:59 PM
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titanhank titanhank is offline
 
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On the side of your carb is a small metal plate with three holes. This is the accelerator pump adjustment. Start in the middle hole and put it another hole until it runs smooth when advancing the throttle. My engine will stumble just a little when the OAT is hot and does perfect when the temps are cold outside. This tells me i am to rich on the pump adjustment. The denser cold air will take the extra gas. I am going to adjust it at next oil change.
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  #62  
Old 11-16-2019, 06:02 PM
Turbo69bird Turbo69bird is offline
 
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Originally Posted by titanhank View Post
On the side of your carb is a small metal plate with three holes. This is the accelerator pump adjustment. Start in the middle hole and put it another hole until it runs smooth when advancing the throttle. My engine will stumble just a little when the OAT is hot and does perfect when the temps are cold outside. This tells me i am to rich on the pump adjustment. The denser cold air will take the extra gas. I am going to adjust it at next oil change.
I’ll try that but Fred Stucklen ( previous owner ) made all kinds of mods to this thing years ago and never could get it to go away. It’s also when you pull back the throttle coming into a pattern as well or at the top of climb when you pull back so it’s not just when advancing the throttle although that is the part I’m more concerned with right now .
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Last edited by Turbo69bird : 11-16-2019 at 08:48 PM.
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  #63  
Old 11-17-2019, 11:38 PM
Turbo69bird Turbo69bird is offline
 
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Anyone have thoughts on Ellison or other EFI or MFI or carb type options? Want to make the right choice if I swap it out.
Itís flown like this for a very long time and itís been reliable but much like others have reported ití can make passengers a little nervous and itís definitely worse with the better baffle material and proper seal
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  #64  
Old 11-18-2019, 12:37 AM
lr172 lr172 is offline
 
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Originally Posted by Turbo69bird View Post
I’ll try that but Fred Stucklen ( previous owner ) made all kinds of mods to this thing years ago and never could get it to go away. It’s also when you pull back the throttle coming into a pattern as well or at the top of climb when you pull back so it’s not just when advancing the throttle although that is the part I’m more concerned with right now .
Do some research on the difference between a rich stumble (possibly the burble you describe) and a lean bog. You can be either under enriched or over enriched on your acceleration. The difference is easy to differentiate once you understand them. Determine which it is first and then adjust the accel pump lever accordingly. The holes that offer more leverage (typically the ones closer to the arm and further from the pivot), deliver more fuel during throttle advance (i.e. richer transition).

What rpm are you decellerating to when you have the stumble? If it is 1200 or below, you may be able to address that with your idle mixture. When decelerating to lower RPMs, the idle mixture can cause these type of problems.

Larry
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Last edited by lr172 : 11-18-2019 at 12:42 AM.
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  #65  
Old 11-18-2019, 07:52 AM
Turbo69bird Turbo69bird is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lr172 View Post
Do some research on the difference between a rich stumble (possibly the burble you describe) and a lean bog. You can be either under enriched or over enriched on your acceleration. The difference is easy to differentiate once you understand them. Determine which it is first and then adjust the accel pump lever accordingly. The holes that offer more leverage (typically the ones closer to the arm and further from the pivot), deliver more fuel during throttle advance (i.e. richer transition).

What rpm are you decellerating to when you have the stumble? If it is 1200 or below, you may be able to address that with your idle mixture. When decelerating to lower RPMs, the idle mixture can cause these type of problems.

Larry
I appreciate the post, the main burble is something people o. Here have had issues with for years. Done major mods to the 10-5009 carb and even changed it to a 10-5009N with the pepper pot nozzle and still carbs that have it still cannot seem to shake it.
Iím
Am ex drag racer since 1987 so Iím fairly familiar with carbs having run everything from Q jets to Holley to SA carbs on my MGA. Although I havenít done anything with this one. Mainly because so really good carb shops have done these and not been able to resolve the issues and Fred is a VERY thourough person and he couldnít resolve it. And I know he changed to a 1 piece Venturi and everything . So Iím sure he tried that
But Iíll give it a go anyway because one thing drag racing has taught me is never say never. Lol

But being so many people have had this issue and it seems to be something in the casting I may be changing carb bodies
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  #66  
Old 11-18-2019, 09:51 AM
lr172 lr172 is offline
 
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Originally Posted by Turbo69bird View Post
I appreciate the post, the main burble is something people o. Here have had issues with for years. Done major mods to the 10-5009 carb and even changed it to a 10-5009N with the pepper pot nozzle and still carbs that have it still cannot seem to shake it.
I’m
Am ex drag racer since 1987 so I’m fairly familiar with carbs having run everything from Q jets to Holley to SA carbs on my MGA. Although I haven’t done anything with this one. Mainly because so really good carb shops have done these and not been able to resolve the issues and Fred is a VERY thourough person and he couldn’t resolve it. And I know he changed to a 1 piece Venturi and everything . So I’m sure he tried that
But I’ll give it a go anyway because one thing drag racing has taught me is never say never. Lol

But being so many people have had this issue and it seems to be something in the casting I may be changing carb bodies
Best of luck with it. It may be something with that model. I had a 3270 and never had any issues like that and it even had the 2 piece venturi. Have you checked the float level? There have been several ADs on those floats and I expect many people putting them in don't know they have to verify and likely set the float level after installing them. As you know, a 32nd or a 16th makes a big difference. Worse in aviation, as some of it's effects can be offset via the mixture knob, but will be ugly in transitions or lower RPM, as well as full rich settings. Although, if the 5009N was new or rebuilt, I would expect that is not the issue.

Good luck.

Larry
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Last edited by lr172 : 11-18-2019 at 09:56 AM.
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  #67  
Old 11-18-2019, 07:51 PM
Turbo69bird Turbo69bird is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lr172 View Post
Best of luck with it. It may be something with that model. I had a 3270 and never had any issues like that and it even had the 2 piece venturi. Have you checked the float level? There have been several ADs on those floats and I expect many people putting them in don't know they have to verify and likely set the float level after installing them. As you know, a 32nd or a 16th makes a big difference. Worse in aviation, as some of it's effects can be offset via the mixture knob, but will be ugly in transitions or lower RPM, as well as full rich settings. Although, if the 5009N was new or rebuilt, I would expect that is not the issue.

Good luck.




Larry

Thanks for the suggestions I'll look into all these items when I get it apart. Really want to get this sorted out. To many people it probably wouldn't be as big a deal but as an ex racer and engine builder I really like things to run properly. I'm not as likely to dig into this as with the cars (I like big turbos on those ) but it'll probably happen sooner than later.who knows maybe this will see a turbo soon too.
And not a turbo normalized set up but more like 1 bar of boost or more for a little power. Im actually very surprised I don't see turbo kits for these engines yet.

They are very reliable if set up properly to, I have 9 years at 1000 hp on my set up without even changing a spark plug.
designed and built the whole set up myself too.

Sadly once I dig into this thing I feel I won't be able to stop lol.
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  #68  
Old 11-21-2019, 09:42 PM
Turbo69bird Turbo69bird is offline
 
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So flew the airplane today and it was a slightly warmer day today. Oddly I ran the airplane w car. Heat and stumble on applying power was worse so I leaned it and it went away so itís a rich stumble.

I couldnít duplicate the stumble on pulling back the throttle in the pattern no matter what I did.

Climb rate w me alone in the airplane between zero and 100 ft agl was below 500 ft per minute at approx 80 90 mph. Hit 100 mph and it jumped up to 800 ft per minute as it climbed mph to 110 to 120 mph it hit 1000 ft per minute or more. 6 take offs and landings all similar but leaning the mixture somewhat improved the take off roll distance . Exactly opposite what Iíd have expected

Chts never went above 380 even if I pulled the nose up and climbed at 90 mph when slightly leaned.

Throttle response as checked on the ground when Iíd push the throttle in quickly was much better ( dare I say perfect ) when leaned.
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Special Thanks to Fred Stucklen


While I'm not a builder if I happen to give advice , I will not be responsible for damage to equipment, your ego, parts, world wide power outages, spontaneously generated black holes, planetary disruptions, or personal injury that may result from the use of this advice.
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  #69  
Old 11-30-2019, 07:00 PM
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gmcjetpilot gmcjetpilot is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Turbo69bird View Post
So flew the airplane today and it was a slightly warmer day today.
I went through thread but how do your plugs look.
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  #70  
Old 11-30-2019, 09:43 PM
Turbo69bird Turbo69bird is offline
 
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Originally Posted by gmcjetpilot View Post
I went through thread but how do your plugs look.
Plugs looked good in fact had a little lead fouling which I felt was contradictory to the lean stumble I thought I was having.
Turns out it’s probably in line with rich stumble.

I watched a take off video of a
Bunch of vans aircraft today on YouTube and don’t feel they climbed out any different than mine.
And I feel like leaning it greatly improved it’s take off climb
Of course I was alone on that test flight. True measure will be a flight w passengers.

This is probably similar to my take off angle.


https://youtu.be/na2pxJCKeUs
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While I'm not a builder if I happen to give advice , I will not be responsible for damage to equipment, your ego, parts, world wide power outages, spontaneously generated black holes, planetary disruptions, or personal injury that may result from the use of this advice.

Last edited by Turbo69bird : 11-30-2019 at 09:51 PM.
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