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Aircraft Wraps

Mike S said:
I was wondering the same thing.

My guess is a pin hole to let the fuel/vapor out will take care of it???
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Mike & Sean - great question that has me responding one more time

This is something we have had come through the emails very recently and now here and I would like to hopefully address it.

The one thing we are not going to pretend to be is what I like to call 'magic in a bottle', if there is a leak in your tank - vinyl is not the solution.

We are going to run some tests on this now, we have a specific sealant for the wrap which is petroleum resistant. We would need the owner to identify potential problem areas before installation so we can utilise the sealant before installation commences.

Failing that - the pin hole solution would work but we will run our tests and see what we can come up with.

This will be a work in progress - please give us time on this to come back to you.

As it stands I will say that vinyl and paint in this respect will do the same thing, with the pinhole solution being possible with vinyl.

Guy

www.Aircraftwraps.com
Replacing paint with performance.
 
AircraftWraps said:
I've heard from Scott about VMAN - and the challenge is on if he can spare the week? Failing that we will work out a way to wrap it in midair!!
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Well, V-man recently said he wanted to do the Virginia Aviation Ambassador program (http://www.doav.virginia.gov/vaap.htm) and do it in a week (that's almost certainly a record). A few days later he said he was coming down. Alas his tracker showed him heading to New Hampshire. Me thinks he's related to Wrong Way Corrigan. Assuming he can get his bearings straight (or correct that compass error), and find your shop, I'll pick him up and bring him back to VA for a week of flying in my 9A and then return him to you to pick the plane up.
 
rmartingt said:
Even though I'm a few years away from paint or other finishing, I've had a couple people refer me to your website in the past week. That says something, I guess.

Anyway, some questions:

1. What kind of surface preparation is recommended? Prime, paint, leave bare, polish, scotchbrite, or...?

2. How are removable items (access covers, fuel tanks, wingtips, cowl, etc.) handled? Are control surfaces removed and fully wrapped separately? Are things like antennae and lights removed so the wrap can get underneath the edges?

3. Is the process made easier by bringing the aircraft in disassembled (e.g., trucking it in with the wings off)? Is it easier to do prior to first flight so you don't have to clean oil and bugs?

4. If you can provide a ballpark estimate, what would a simple two-color full-aircraft wrap run?
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I apologise for missing this post

1. Bare, primed or painted is fine. Any decent dents or scratches will show through just like they would with paint - its rare we see deep enough scratches that show through but we've seen a couple of chips that needed filling.

2. Access - we design our wraps around your requirements, that's the benefit of us being home builders, pilots up to the dizzying heights of aerospace engineer.

We make panels accessible without needing to remove or damage the wrap - no difference between paint and our wrap.

All access panels, fairings, etc are individually pulled to be wrapped then reassembled by experienced builders. We own similar aircraft that we've built by hand and that makes us protective of who gets to use tools and who touches any delicate items.

3. It would be but we like to see you fly in and we like to see you fly out - we wouldn't have it any other way. On the way out we will probably grab some aerial shots for you as well.

4. If you drop us a line at [email protected] I will get back to you with a cost - I don't want to turn this great thread into a sales thread.

I just read from a client that emails sent to hotmail went to Junk - if you haven't seen a response from us (we've responded to every email we've received so far) please check your junk mail - if no luck drop me a line and I will work out a way to get to you.
 
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Chrome

What about a chrome vinyl ? Can we have finaly a polished aircraft look without the polishing nightmare ??
 
How about the fiberglass parts? Do all of the pinholes need to be taken care of like you do for a good paint job?
 
And while we're talking about fiberglass, how about the canopy plexi to fiberglass fairing transition? How well does that intersection need to be prepared prior to a wrap? Do you wrap right up to the edge of the plexi and then run a bead of proseal like some painters do?
 
After reading this thread I have a few questions.

I have had the pleasure of removing (trying to remove) some wrap material from trucks in the past. I have no idea how long they were on there but it was a nightmare because it had dried and turned hard.
Is there an ideal longest time you should leave wrap on before it is hard to remove?

What do you do if the leading edges get abraded. Can a nice looking patch be done.

I read above that the wrap was 3.5 mm thick. Is this correct? If so that would mean that you would be making most of the airplane 7 mm thicker. What does that do to the airflow and gaps between moving parts such as flaps and wings?

Can it be polished or waxed?

Thank you!
Charles
 
hogie said:
How about the fiberglass parts? Do all of the pinholes need to be taken care of like you do for a good paint job?
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pinholes do not need filled. My fiberglass is completely untouched from vans and sam james cowl. Vans cowl will need the weave covered and blended. Pinholes... save your time and bring it to us.

I hate fiberglass work...:(
 
Gash said:
And while we're talking about fiberglass, how about the canopy plexi to fiberglass fairing transition? How well does that intersection need to be prepared prior to a wrap? Do you wrap right up to the edge of the plexi and then run a bead of proseal like some painters do?
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My plane is over the pro seal/5200 and onto the canopy. I don't like it. Our clients get the vinyl trimmed to edge of fiberglass. Of course, owner picks and we will do either.
 
BTW,

sent Guy home to get some sleep after a very long couple of days.

I just left the hangar and making a replies before the wife put dinner on the table.

regards,

Scott
 
I'm not Guy but I'll try to answer with proper grammar and structure :roll eyes:


Truck vinyl: I can not comment on the type of vinyl that was used or the quality. I've had many questions about customers past experiences with "XYZ" vinyl. I've waited many years for vinyl to get to the level that it is at (its only going to get better and with our contacts we have access to test product before its on market). I cannot comment on others product choices ranging from economy, mid grade, industrial vinyl. Aircraftwraps only uses the "Top-shelf" vinyl. We use only the best and most advance vinyl/materials from our suppliers. Aircraftwraps will stand behind our products and services.

As for removal: We would do it for you.

abraded edges: we install with these issues planned out in advance. That however is part of our process and remain closed regarding sharing info gathered over years and hours of test flights. (Personally from me: sorry but I hope you understand)

3.5mils after installed with heat and pressure: thick sheet of printer paper or equivalent.

Wax or polish: Spray with water and dawn dish soap... you will be amazed at how much it shines and sparkles. No polishing, but you can use a spray wax if you desire an even brighter finish.

Regards,

Scott


Charles in SC said:
After reading this thread I have a few questions.

I have had the pleasure of removing (trying to remove) some wrap material from trucks in the past. I have no idea how long they were on there but it was a nightmare because it had dried and turned hard.
Is there an ideal longest time you should leave wrap on before it is hard to remove?

What do you do if the leading edges get abraded. Can a nice looking patch be done.

I read above that the wrap was 3.5 mm thick. Is this correct? If so that would mean that you would be making most of the airplane 7 mm thicker. What does that do to the airflow and gaps between moving parts such as flaps and wings?

Can it be polished or waxed?

Thank you!
Charles
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Thanks for all the detailed info, it's something I am strongly considering. I'd still like to hear more about the corrosion issue, however, should I wrap my plane without paint underneath. Is there any reason to be concerned with moisture being trapped and causing issues? Especially because they would be hard to spot once wrapped. Thanks again

Chris
 
Rhino889 said:
Respectfully... the tail section is horrible and tedious.
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I should have said... I was only referring to the metalwork, not the intersection fairings or tips. My aircraft has painted fibreglass of a colour I like, and I've been thinking about wrapping the horizontal and vertical surfaces to match. As simple flat surfaces, it shouldn't be that big a task. I agree, the compound curves would be a heck of a job.

++edit: I missed the oil and gas question. The only time my wing doesn't get fuel poured on it is when some one else does it! I can also show you the pooling oil on my tailwheel hangar spot. My smoke take is set to "ridiculous smoke" and sprays the entire belly. My planes belly is disgusting with oil, this oil flows down while sitting on the tailwheel and pools on the floor. Yes, we adjusted our install process for such factors.
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Good info, thanks.
 
YellowJacket RV9 said:
Thanks for all the detailed info, it's something I am strongly considering. I'd still like to hear more about the corrosion issue, however, should I wrap my plane without paint underneath. Is there any reason to be concerned with moisture being trapped and causing issues? Especially because they would be hard to spot once wrapped. Thanks again

Chris
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Chris,

I can only offer our tested experiences. Past that, a simple priming of the aircraft before a complete wrap would be a more conservative approach. In aviation I have rarely seen an example of taking the conservative approach being a bad thing? We can do all bare, primed, painted, etc.

Our prep work is what prevents moisture during or after the process.

Regards,

Scott
 
Closterman said:
What about a chrome vinyl ? Can we have finaly a polished aircraft look without the polishing nightmare ??
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I almost missed your post... sorry.

We have had a huge request for chrome vinyl. Look at the tail numbers of my aircraft and you'll see chrome. Look at the front of our shop refrig and you'll see the rest ;)

Seriously, I wanted to be able to offer chrome spinners and spent hundreds on experimenting with every chrome I could get my hands on. That product is just something I wish not to stand behind. We will do it only after an honest conversation with the owner.

3M came out with a chrome for testing last year. I thought it was amazing. It actually came with an extra sheet of clear for install and after the install you peeled the clear away. This kept scratches from just the install from happening. 3M pulled that product without production. I don't know why and am waiting for the unknown issue to be resolved.

Every Chrome I've seen except for the 3M I just described has a slight "orange peel" texture. I'm waiting for the pure smooth sheet 3M proved they can eventually produce.

Regards,

Scott
 
signing off for the night

Fellow Pilot/Builders,

Aircraftwraps sales director touched this a few post ago.

Guy said, "we will not be the magic in a bottle company". This is why I brought him in from his prior business.

What he's saying is... we are not always the answer. Our product is not magic and we won't claim that it is. It's just another option that we builders can enjoy in the experimental aircraft community.

If you contact us and we ask you questions, its because we might not think our product fits your individual situation. If that is the case, you will get an honest answer. We have plenty of orders flowing in. We do not need, nor do we ever want to tarnish our reputation by misrepresenting our product.

When you talk to me on the phone or our next fly-in and I seem excited... I am! I personally believe aircraftwraps can provide pilot/builders significant positives in the aircraft color scheme market.

Hopefully we have been as open as we can be while protecting our hard earned expertise in this market.

Kindest regards and thank you to the VAF community embracing or company.

Scott
 
ok, one more

Snowflake said:
One last question: when are you opening an office in the Pacific Northwest? :)
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We have exposure in all areas of the country. Location is not an issue. We can discuss if you seek to have us wrap in your location.

We are currently looking at exposer in Brazil (all the cool videos come from South America!) and England (They pay like $14 per US gallon over there!?). Anyways, England is in our Design stage currently.

Not that it matters on this forum, but we are also enjoying FAA conversations regarding Certified aircraft:(

Again, Part of our business model.
 
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wrap over primed airplane

Rhino889 said:
Chris,

I can only offer our tested experiences. Past that, a simple priming of the aircraft before a complete wrap would be a more conservative approach. In aviation I have rarely seen an example of taking the conservative approach being a bad thing? We can do all bare, primed, painted, etc.

Our prep work is what prevents moisture during or after the process.

Regards,

Scott
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I was interested before but now even more. I can shoot primer!

Scott
Thank you for sticking around and answering the thread. You've provided a lot to ponder.
In your testing, have you found an exterior primer that is preferred under the wrap?
 
wirejock said:
I was interested before but now even more. I can shoot primer!

Scott
Thank you for sticking around and answering the thread. You've provided a lot to ponder.
In your testing, have you found an exterior primer that is preferred under the wrap?
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Larry,

In my experience, paint, primer, bare alum... looks all equally amazing on the finish.

I'm sorry, Our mistake for not addressing that earlier.

Personally I would have paid over any paint job amount to get my aircraft as light as possible using vinyl wraps. This is the only reason I went bare aluminum, extreme relative weight savings. My goal is to go vertical in acro and as fast as possible racing from A to B. If you lower the weight while maintaining the given power, you are increasing performance in the simplest of terms. Our Trademarking "replacing paint with performance" I guess focuses our companies attention on this single topic?

Not everyone wants that stuff :confused:

We have color matched to existing painted parts after the builder decided painting was not there thing. We have wrapped over home-brew paint jobs that didn't turn out the way the build wanted. We have wrapped over primer.

Thank you very much for the post! You showed us an area that we failed to communicate effectively regarding the options.

Scott
 
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Rhino889 said:
What he's saying is... we are not always the answer. Our product is not magic and we won't claim that it is. It's just another option that we builders can enjoy in the experimental aircraft community.
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When would a wrap not be advisable? I can't think off hand why you wouldn't wrap instead of paint.

You mentioned certified aircraft in passing. I have a Cessna 172 I might consider wrapping. What are the FAA issues, if any?
 
wrap

Scott did you do the PC_12 based in Daytona with the reef scene on it its a 300 mph plane all weather and it was holding up well.
Bob
 
emuyshondt said:
When would a wrap not be advisable? I can't think off hand why you wouldn't wrap instead of paint.

You mentioned certified aircraft in passing. I have a Cessna 172 I might consider wrapping. What are the FAA issues, if any?
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Aircraft not hangared and parked on tie-downs in the southern states. The UV charts show a slight advantage to paint. Slight....

Personal experience again: When I have to go fly the Jet, I fly the 8 to that work. I leave my plane outside in the South Florida sun, rain, wind for 4-5 days at a time. Other then Vlad ;) my plane spends much more time outside in the elements then the average RV/Sonex/Searey/etc. I've actually been offered a free hangar and kindly refused on the grounds of research and testing! :eek:



I thought I was cool flying to work till I parked next to a single families private 777 and their 737 dingy for support staff!



Edited: sales is going to laugh at this! After I get some sleep I might delete this? I placed oracal and 3M vinyl scrap strips on the top of my truck 34 months ago. They all have spec sheets and test their products tremendously... but I'm an experimenter and homebuilder! We test stuff our way! 2 days ago I took this picture after leaving the carwash. I intentionally made scraggly shapes and folded up the trail edges. Trying to give a worse case scenario. These have been run through the car wash every week and never been out of the sun one day in that timeframe. Nothing has changed, no fading, no lifting even with these purposefully nasty pieces.

 
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6 Gun said:
Scott did you do the PC_12 based in Daytona with the reef scene on it its a 300 mph plane all weather and it was holding up well.
Bob
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Bob,

No, not ours. We do not wish to enter into the pressurized market at this time. We have our market and wish to be the leader and continue serving our fellow pilot/builders.

Note: airlines have been flying with vinyl for more then a decade. 500mph and never out of the sun, snow, etc. Getting sprayed with de-icing fluid! Sports team logos, animals, Harry Porter... almost all vinyl.

Scott
 
Arlen said:
What does a complete wrap weigh?
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Dependent on design and complexity. Every install of course is unique. A good rule of thumb is whatever a design would be in paint, half that. Use of primer (thanks Larry) or any other factors unique to that aircraft can close that gap.

Scott

PS you are a short RV flight from us. Please come see us in north palm beach and we can show you our work. Send us an email at [email protected]
 
glenn654 said:
Scott,

I like a high gloss wet looking finish, is that something you can do?


Glenn Wilkinson
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The white gloss we just installed was amazing. Please use the contact me box at the bottom of our website and we can send samples.
 
YellowJacket RV9 said:
Thanks for all the detailed info, it's something I am strongly considering. I'd still like to hear more about the corrosion issue, however, should I wrap my plane without paint underneath. Is there any reason to be concerned with moisture being trapped and causing issues? Especially because they would be hard to spot once wrapped. Thanks again
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Just to double down on this

The way we initially prep the aircraft removes the moisture but coupled with that we added a further process in the application of the vinyl itself to remove any residual that may be present.
 
emuyshondt said:
When would a wrap not be advisable? I can't think off hand why you wouldn't wrap instead of paint.

You mentioned certified aircraft in passing. I have a Cessna 172 I might consider wrapping. What are the FAA issues, if any?
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When you have a leaky tank ;)

This was why I said we are not magic in a bottle in a previous post
 
Charles in SC said:
After reading this thread I have a few questions.

I have had the pleasure of removing (trying to remove) some wrap material from trucks in the past. I have no idea how long they were on there but it was a nightmare because it had dried and turned hard.
Is there an ideal longest time you should leave wrap on before it is hard to remove?

Thank you!
Charles
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Charles, I know Scott touched on this but I will be honest with you and perhaps the community here can get behind this (either that or I'm going to get nailed!)

I'm a firm believer of 'show and tell' - people have repeatedly asked about removing vinyl and so I would like to show the process.

I have mentioned this to Scott and firmly believe that in the interest of all you fellow builders myself and Scott should pull the entire wrap off his plane on video :D

Perhaps I should start a poll Scott??:p
 
This is a 3M Vinyl Sticker we have on our Jet since June 2010.

We have on each side of the tail. We have been thru rain/ice/snow storms. We have crossed the Atlantic at leads 2 dozen times. When not at our home base we sit out on the ramp (last year I spent 150+ days in a hotel. We typically fly between FL370 and FL410.

No issues, No peeling, No tearing, No Ripping, No Sun fading, No signs of corrosion underneath (she is painted underneath).

IMG00042-20100809-1626_zpsc725fae8.jpg
 
Is it possible to repair the vinyl? Say you had to disassemble for maintenance/repair or developed a fuel leak, can you get it back to its original state? Do you have to start over on the whole aircraft?
 
iPhone post.

Anyone in the palm beach area that wants to stop by? I'm giving hangar tours of the aircraft already. Please stop over by car or plane. We want to show off our work. I'll be here till 1pm.

 
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JumpNurse said:
Is it possible to repair the vinyl? Say you had to disassemble for maintenance/repair or developed a fuel leak, can you get it back to its original state? Do you have to start over on the whole aircraft?
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We would be able to install an almost invisible seam where the vinyl would be cut for tank repair.

There is zero difference between access panels and the like from our wraps or paint.
 
Rivets!

DHeal said:
And what about those domed pop-rivet heads on our RV-12s? Can the wrap cleanly conform with the heads or will there be some noticeable "spanning" from rivet head-to-adjacent base skin??
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I'm going to apologise now but you are up close and personal

Please note this is a quick and dirty example done by Scott to get the pictures back to you guys

rivet4.jpg

Rivet1.jpg

Rivet2.jpg

Rivet3.jpg
 
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Looks mighty good - AND it will save me from filling all those rivet holes to keep the gunk and corrosion out of them!
 
I had the opportunity to meet with Scott today while on a layover in West Palm Beach. We spent a good hour looking at different aircraft, asking questions and getting a good idea if this is something I would be interested in when I purchase an RV8. My answer would be YES. Not only from what I saw and witnessed firsthand on the appearance and quality, but the professional attitude these people have. I was amazed at how the aircraft looked up close, clean lines, no bubbles, artwork, etc. I would suggest if you get a chance to see these aircraft up close you should do so and will be impressed.
I would also like to Thank Scott for turning around to come back and visit with us after already leaving for the day.
 
jdhmotor said:
I had the opportunity to meet with Scott today while on a layover in West Palm Beach. We spent a good hour looking at different aircraft, asking questions and getting a good idea if this is something I would be interested in when I purchase an RV8. My answer would be YES. Not only from what I saw and witnessed firsthand on the appearance and quality, but the professional attitude these people have. I was amazed at how the aircraft looked up close, clean lines, no bubbles, artwork, etc. I would suggest if you get a chance to see these aircraft up close you should do so and will be impressed.
I would also like to Thank Scott for turning around to come back and visit with us after already leaving for the day.
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jdhmotor

Thank you so much for the positive review of the work here at AW, I know Scott will be thrilled to see this when he has chance to pop on the forums.

Scott escaped a conversation about our new payment gateway with a text to me saying 'have to go back to the hangar, I have someone else coming to take a look' - you saved him and left me to it!

Again, thank you for your kind words and we hope your RV8 purchase goes smoothly!
 
How much does it cost?

I am at the point where I am seeing the light at the end of the tunnel and am contemplating paint/wrap. How much would it cost to wrap an 8A with, for example 2 colors and a standard N number scheme? I know that the cost varies, but it would be good to know what sort of range we are talking about.

Thanks!
 
Steve Ashby said:
I am at the point where I am seeing the light at the end of the tunnel and am contemplating paint/wrap. How much would it cost to wrap an 8A with, for example 2 colors and a standard N number scheme? I know that the cost varies, but it would be good to know what sort of range we are talking about.

Thanks!
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Hi Steve

Would you mind popping onto our site and submitting your details through the Contact page and I will happily assist via email.

Whilst we are of course interested in selling our product I want to keep this thread going and refrain from turning it into a sales thread - hopefully you understand.

Kind Regards
 
jdhmotor said:
I had the opportunity to meet with Scott today while on a layover in West Palm Beach. We spent a good hour looking at different aircraft, asking questions and getting a good idea if this is something I would be interested in when I purchase an RV8. My answer would be YES. Not only from what I saw and witnessed firsthand on the appearance and quality, but the professional attitude these people have. I was amazed at how the aircraft looked up close, clean lines, no bubbles, artwork, etc. I would suggest if you get a chance to see these aircraft up close you should do so and will be impressed.
I would also like to Thank Scott for turning around to come back and visit with us after already leaving for the day.
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Hey Guys,

Thanks for the kind words and the pleasure was all mine! Get that 8 and cruise the wife in comfort! I had fun showing you and others around our aircraft today. I always enjoy when our guest can't believe these planes are wrapped. Even while actually touching the aircraft and looking from nose distance away:D

We even covered the age-old CS Prop vs Fixed... Catto didn't even know they have a sells rep in palm beach!? :roll eyes:

Our guest from just north... hope you enjoyed the Tiki Bars I steered you to? Oh wait,... you might still be there!? :eek:

Regards,

Scott
 
johnny stick said:
hey show us some pictures, preferably with some cuties.
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Cuties:



This is Guy... not so cute :(

Thought I would put a face to the man everyone has been emailing back and forth with.

Thats as close as i let him to the wrapped vinyl. I had to give him the beer just to keep his hands off my work!:mad:

Seriously... let me know if there is anything specific you would like to see?
 
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Most people yesterday were really surprised how our metal flake/metallic really comes alive in the sunlight. The different colors really shine in the sun.

I thought this was common knowledge because I've been dealing with vinyl for years now. (kinda like when pilots at a party start the story with, NDB, ILS, #@%, etc. and expect everyone to know what we are talking about!?)

Pictures worth a thousand words:

 
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What happens when a crack develops in the skin? Will it be visible?

What about smoking rivets? Will those be visible in any way? Will the vinyl bubble in that area so you know something is wrong?

Thanks for your guys great responses I am really considering going this route.

Thanks,
 
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