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  #21  
Old 07-05-2016, 09:47 PM
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Toobuilder Toobuilder is offline
 
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Interesting that he wraps his exhaust.
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WARNING! Incorrect design and/or fabrication of aircraft and/or components may result in injury or death. Information presented in this post is based on my own experience - Reader has sole responsibility for determining accuracy or suitability for use.

Michael Robinson
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1940 Taylorcraft BL-65 -flying
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  #22  
Old 07-07-2016, 12:44 PM
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rv6ejguy rv6ejguy is offline
 
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"Some further testing at 3000’ 2230 rpm 19.8”map 15.8 a/r 179 mph TAS 85 OAT.

#1 —— no trim required
#2 —— no trim required
#3 —— -3%
#4 —— -2%

Then they all peaked at the same time at 15.2 with mixture knob.

EGT spread during a 22 min flight was 34-50 degrees
CHT spread was 21-30 degrees"

Despite what some people have said, this test would seem to validate my earlier theory that certain manifolds/ heads are the root of poor mixture distribution and high GAMI spread like we saw in one instance a few months back with over a 10% imbalance in trim required to make all cylinder peak at the same time. The SD intake with the flowed heads keeps things pretty close.
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Ross Farnham, Calgary, Alberta
Turbo Subaru EJ22, Marcotte M-300, IVO, RV6A C-GVZX flying from CYBW- 415.8 hrs. on the Hobbs,
RV10 95% built- Sold 2016
http://www.sdsefi.com/aircraft.html
http://sdsefi.com/cpi.htm


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  #23  
Old 07-14-2016, 05:33 PM
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rv6ejguy rv6ejguy is offline
 
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Default Hot Start Testing

Dave completed some more testing in very hot conditions. It seems like hot starting will be no issue with the EFI:

"I donít see vapor locking ever being a problem, because when I extremely heat soaked everything on the ground to 360 to 370 CHTs (the hottest iíve ever seen) with an oil temp of 232 and the #4 injector reaching 324 after shut down, I let it sit for perhaps 4-5 mins and it started perfectly after 1 1/2-2 blades and idled smooth at 600 rpm. The fuel manifold seems to hold about 140-135 degrees."
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Ross Farnham, Calgary, Alberta
Turbo Subaru EJ22, Marcotte M-300, IVO, RV6A C-GVZX flying from CYBW- 415.8 hrs. on the Hobbs,
RV10 95% built- Sold 2016
http://www.sdsefi.com/aircraft.html
http://sdsefi.com/cpi.htm


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  #24  
Old 07-15-2016, 07:27 AM
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rv6ejguy rv6ejguy is offline
 
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Default Range and FF Testing

Another update from Dave this morning.

"I have used the individual cylinder trimming several times now at different altitudes, MAPS and pwr settings. Conditions seems to change the order of cylinders peaking. In my case, it’s never too much in one way or another. Depending on conditions, different cylinders require different % to peak, usually 2 or 3 of the cylinders require no change and the others require no more then -2% or the 1 cylinder that requires +1% when the other 3 require nothing.

I believe that under WOT I have seen 2 mph increase when all the cylinders peaked at the same time. It’s nice to know that you're getting maximum power out of the fuel from all the cylinders at the time. It’s easy to do! What a neat system.

I’m dialing in the SDS fuel flow signal now and it’s apparent that it will be the best mpg I’ve ever had. Can’t wait to get the real numbers at altitude leaned to best FF. Today it said I had 1000 miles range on 32 gals, but it’s still indicating more fuel used than I put in so it should get better and that was at only 5000’. This is exciting! Thanks for a great product!"
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Ross Farnham, Calgary, Alberta
Turbo Subaru EJ22, Marcotte M-300, IVO, RV6A C-GVZX flying from CYBW- 415.8 hrs. on the Hobbs,
RV10 95% built- Sold 2016
http://www.sdsefi.com/aircraft.html
http://sdsefi.com/cpi.htm



Last edited by rv6ejguy : 08-08-2016 at 12:57 PM. Reason: Spelling error
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  #25  
Old 07-18-2016, 07:38 AM
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Default FF EGT/CHT Data

"Diane and I flew to Arnold to see the carbon wing replacement project for RVs. The set we saw was for Bob Mills RV6. Really great work.

I think I have the FF from the SDS signal dialed in now, so we got to test cruise economy at 10500’.

Cruise conditions:
2220 RPM 21” MAP 55 F OAT 10500’ Palt 12826’ Dalt

I trimmed each cylinder to max CHT as follows: #1 “0" with the mixture knob and #2 “0", #3 “+1", #4 “-1" with the programmer trim window.
I leaned to an AFR 16.0 (that’s the max range my current lambda sensor will indicate) which resulted in:
200 MPH TAS at 6.8 GPH at about 29 MPG.
188 F oil temp
#1 injector 203 F
#4 injector 210 F

EGTs CHTs
1 1292 296
2 1304 295
3 1273 277
4 1253 295
spread 51 19

It has never run smoother under those conditions. It's truly amazing how smooth it runs at that lean an AFR. It used to miss and run kind of rough under lean conditions now it just loses power. Also, not a bad fuel burn at that speed.

Some of the difference in the EGT temps between 1 and 3 as compared to 2 and 4 could be the EGT probe locations because they are rotated differently on the pipes.

I’m not certain about #3 CHT because it has the same compression as the others- (more air to that cylinder maybe).

Bottom line is under those cruise conditions I think I’m getting 3-4 more MPG. I will do a maximum MPG test soon but that will be at 17500’ and slowed down to about 110 indicated. I would love to see nearly 50 mpg. my best previous was with higher compression pistons 12.2:1 and was 42 mpg in 2000.

When I did the personal air vehicle challenge in Santa Rosa, CA. in 2007 the best I ever got was 27.4 and that was flying at approximately 140 mph because that is speed that produced the greatest efficiency (mph x mpg) the way they judged it at gross wt at takeoff on a 400 mile course."
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Ross Farnham, Calgary, Alberta
Turbo Subaru EJ22, Marcotte M-300, IVO, RV6A C-GVZX flying from CYBW- 415.8 hrs. on the Hobbs,
RV10 95% built- Sold 2016
http://www.sdsefi.com/aircraft.html
http://sdsefi.com/cpi.htm



Last edited by rv6ejguy : 08-08-2016 at 12:58 PM. Reason: Spelling error
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  #26  
Old 08-06-2016, 08:49 AM
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Default Amazing Numbers

Dave was up testing again today.

" I finished testing the injector temps. It appears even with pretty high OATs 90-100 the injectors will never make the 284 degrees F. In a WOT climb at 120 mph IAS with an AFR 12.4 from 600’ to 17,500’ Palt. With a 23 degree F OAT at 17500, injectors #2 & #3 are the same ± 2-5 degrees. They start at 205 and decrease to 165 during the climb. #1 & #4 essentially parallel each other. #4 starts around 260 and decreases to about 205. #1 stays about 15 degrees lower.

By the way, I made 17500’ in 10 1/2 minutes. The plane was just the way I fly it everyday with all the extra stuff which includes my oxygen system in it and full fuel. However I normally just do an enroute climb at 140 mph IAS so things would be even cooler.

I have a dynamic pressure calculator and under those conditions accounting for Q you should have a MAP of 15.7” and i was getting 16.4” so it does seem I’m getting .7” boost above ambient + Q adjusted for OAT.
At 17500’ I was able to go 232 mph max speed at 9.7 gph with a MAP of 16.4 and AFR of 12.4. that’s a good fuel flow for that speed.

The best reasonable data I collected was 197 mph TAS with a fuel flow of 5.2 gph with an AFR of 18.0. so, it cost 4.5 gph to go 35 mph faster. It’s just not a slippery air frame and it has the wrong wing aspect ratio.
The best mpg was about 39.7 and that's lower then when I was running 12.2:1 compression. It seems as I leaned it further the plane just slows down. it runs great, just not making enough power to maintain the speed. The best it ever did with the high compression was 42 mpg at 14000’ but I haven’t tried that yet. I think it’s just all the power I can make and it's an RV metal airframe.

With the mixture knob centered on zero at 17500’ the AFR is 15.7. however, with a 16.2” MAP and 2170 rpm produced 209 mph TAS at 5.7 gph. It runs smooth to 19.0 AFR and produces 182 mph TAS at 4.8 gph. I’m getting some really good speed."

158 knots TAS on 4.8 GPH. This is a clear demonstration on what EFI and EI can do for the Lycoming. Doubt if a diesel can better that performance but much.
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Ross Farnham, Calgary, Alberta
Turbo Subaru EJ22, Marcotte M-300, IVO, RV6A C-GVZX flying from CYBW- 415.8 hrs. on the Hobbs,
RV10 95% built- Sold 2016
http://www.sdsefi.com/aircraft.html
http://sdsefi.com/cpi.htm



Last edited by rv6ejguy : 08-08-2016 at 01:00 PM.
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  #27  
Old 08-06-2016, 09:49 AM
BillL BillL is offline
 
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Default Lower=better or less?

Quote:
Originally Posted by rv6ejguy View Post
Dave was up testing again today.
<snip> The best mpg was about 39.7 and that's lower then when I was running 12.2:1 compression. It seems as I leaned it further the plane just slows down. it runs great, just not making enough power to maintain the speed.
Outstanding information - Thanks

Does he really mean "lower" mileage? Or "lower" efficiency? I see the 42 mpg at 14k with the higher Cr, but I am still a little confused.

Not surprised that leaner goes slower, I would have thought he would know that - maybe your other post with graphs will explain that. SFC will go up, but power down, it still only pumps so much air.
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  #28  
Old 08-06-2016, 09:53 AM
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rv6ejguy rv6ejguy is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BillL View Post
Outstanding information - Thanks

Does he really mean "lower" mileage? Or "lower" efficiency? I see the 42 mpg at 14k with the higher Cr, but I am still a little confused.

Not surprised that leaner goes slower, I would have thought he would know that - maybe your other post with graphs will explain that. SFC will go up, but power down, it still only pumps so much air.
I think he means lower on both counts- thermal efficiency is reduced with a 2 point drop in CR and as a result, mileage may also be down.

Dave knows leaner is slower but the tradeoff should be better right down to around 18 to 1 AFR.
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Ross Farnham, Calgary, Alberta
Turbo Subaru EJ22, Marcotte M-300, IVO, RV6A C-GVZX flying from CYBW- 415.8 hrs. on the Hobbs,
RV10 95% built- Sold 2016
http://www.sdsefi.com/aircraft.html
http://sdsefi.com/cpi.htm


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  #29  
Old 08-06-2016, 03:12 PM
Dustyone Dustyone is offline
 
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Default Sky Dynamics plenum

Hi Ross,

I see Dave has the new tapered intake tubes from Sky Dynamics with his new plenum. No doubt this all helps with his impressive MP he is seeing along with the reduced restriction from the EFI TB.

Do you know of anyone testing on the IO-540 ?
I see the Sky Dynamic site appears to cater for the Aerobatic/Race guys.
It would be great to see this filter down to simple up grade path for us standard RV-10 drivers.

Thank Dave for sharing,I love it when someone "shakes the tree" to challenge the norm.

Cheers,
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  #30  
Old 08-06-2016, 04:01 PM
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DanH DanH is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rv6ejguy View Post
158 knots TAS on 4.8 GPH. This is a clear demonstration on what EFI and EI can do for the Lycoming.
...at 17,500, with a clean RV-4. Excellent numbers for sure, but it's important to maintain perspective.

Very few of us have an personal data at 17,500. Let's go back to the previous post for something more typical.

Quote:
Cruise conditions:

2220 RPM 21” MAP 55 F OAT 10500’ Palt 12826’ Dalt

200 MPH TAS at 6.8 GPH at about 29 MPG.
Ok, so Dave reports 174 knots on 6.8 with the small RV-4 airframe and a modified 360.

Here's a clean RV-8, dead stock 390 with Slicks and AFP constant flow, similar altitude....hauling camping gear, clothes, and three half-cases of Spotted Cow back from OSH. 178 knots on 7.8:



25~30 LOP was the limits of smoothness with the Slicks, which is why I'm now converting to EI. Go a bit leaner, and the airplane will slow down and burn a little less fuel, closing the gap on that 174/6.8 benchmark. The catch will be mixture distribution with 0.028 restrictors as fuel flow drops closer to 7, and the flow divider starts playing a larger role in cylinder balance. Without question, the SDS EFI will maintain superior balance at very low flows, in particular with the new on-the-fly balancing capability.
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Last edited by DanH : 08-06-2016 at 04:03 PM.
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