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  #11  
Old 12-16-2018, 07:13 AM
wilddog wilddog is offline
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: va.
Posts: 384
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Add shipping to the cost and it has gotten very expensive. $3-4K would not be out of line in the US. Firewall fwd adds up too, oil cooler, exhaust, hoses, cam locks.....
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  #12  
Old 12-16-2018, 07:26 AM
maniago's Avatar
maniago maniago is offline
 
Join Date: Aug 2014
Location: Bowie MD
Posts: 824
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Muuvie View Post
Garage!!
And before I even elected to have the kits mailed here vs. the airport, I checked with the county zoning office and they don't care about me eventually departing from the field in my backyard. I want the journey, I also want said journey to not have too many $5K surprises.
I get it. I'm a builder. I love to build. I wasnt totally sure when I started my build and it wasnt until I got a motor for my project that I figured out it was true. But looking back all the way to childhood and then fwd, I can see that I've always been afflicted with the build disease haha.

But yeah a garage build is key IMHO. Its 10 steps from my living room couch to my airplane, and tho I dont spend every waking hour in the garage, my thoughts are always churning on the next item on the build list. There are low points - always low points - but usually its about something that I have no idea what to do on or am confused.... even for me, VAF is a godsend, and I'm thankful to be tolerated here.
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MustangII (FoldingWing) "Finishing up": IO360B1E,RSA,C2YR-BF/F7666-2,Superior sump,James; 2xHXr,MiniX,EIS,480,327,240,SL30,Navworx; SteamAlt,AS,VSI,wet compass
Don't be a hater; I'm a cousin with thin wings!
N251Y (res)
Jan2019
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  #13  
Old 12-16-2018, 07:43 AM
jeffw@sc47's Avatar
jeffw@sc47 jeffw@sc47 is offline
 
Join Date: Aug 2014
Location: Simpsonville, SC (SC47)
Posts: 248
Default Value for Cost

I was at the point 4 1/2 years ago at age 67 (I still work now) trying to decide whether to build a kit or buy a flying airplane. I decided to build. Thinking back now on that time and what I was considering, given the then current circumstances.

These are the tips of the iceberg:

COSTS:
.commitments and time to get to a flying airplane
.buy Van's kits
.buy lots of tools (but I have a tool fetish! and that puts tools in the value list too)
.buy equipment for the instrument panel
.buy an engine and prop, etc
.buy lots of other stuff
.costs spread over time or large one-time dump
.close-by space to build (I do have my own hangar at an airpark) vs off-site
.unknown life occurrences might arise that will get in the way of a kit build

VALUE:
.more tools in the shop!
.pride in your efforts to build (assemble) you own airplane - I enjoy the build
.know what I have vs buying an unknown (a flying airplane is somewhat more of an unknown no matter how good a pre-buy)
.new stuff or old stuff
.a complete airplane is more like money in the bank than a kit-in-progress

The decision to build, once made, is a very big commitment - a very big commitment. Each step forward commits you exponentially. The value of the kit as it progresses might get you 60% to 70% of your kit's total materials' investment at any point while it is still a project vs a completed flying airplane. When complete and flying I would believe that it is worth 100% or more of the total materials investment; at least for the first year or two.
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Jeff Warren
Simpsonville, SC (@SC47 > 10nm NW Triple Tree)
1946 Bellanca Cruisair 14-13-2 (72 YRS OLD 8/15/18)
RV14A (N14ZT), Ser#140195
Start 10/11/14
Dues paid 12/2/18 (USArmy 2/67-2/70)
www.mykitlog.com/jeffw@sc47

!! I SURVIVED RIPON ARRIVAL - KOSH 7/21/2018 !!
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  #14  
Old 12-16-2018, 08:30 PM
Tommy123 Tommy123 is offline
 
Join Date: Jul 2018
Location: Naples fl
Posts: 135
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Nice thing about aluminum planes is it's fairly easy to tell the build quality if you know what you're looking at. A glass airplane easily hides nasty things.
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  #15  
Old 12-17-2018, 09:19 PM
Capt Capt is offline
 
Join Date: Feb 2017
Location: Australia
Posts: 345
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tommy123 View Post
Nice thing about aluminum planes is it's fairly easy to tell the build quality if you know what you're looking at. A glass airplane easily hides nasty things.
That's very true. Nothing like a metal plane to inspect and or repair!
When I first started looking at buying a plane beyond my Piper spam can I wanted tandem seating, conventional u/c and slider canopy (for that unbeatable cool look) there really was only one choice in the end, the RV8, Vans best design ever with style and performance!
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  #16  
Old 12-18-2018, 10:38 AM
Carl Froehlich's Avatar
Carl Froehlich Carl Froehlich is offline
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Dogwood Airpark (VA42)
Posts: 1,971
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Muuvie View Post
SNIP...

So the point of this is that I'm concerned I'm not being conservative enough in my own build plans. I'm trying to buy a empennage and wings kit next month based on the numbers I came up with myself and there is a discrepancy. At $25K for the aircraft, $33K for the A1B6, $4K for paint (I paint,) $9K for the CS Whirlwind prop and $15K for avionics, I'm looking at $82K as a baseline before any other mods. This almost $25K less than the selling price with a 0 time engine. Am I not accounting for something? I thought I was being fairly conservative, and I don't want to start down a rabbit hole I wasn't expecting.
I kept a detailed spreadsheet of actual cost for the RV-10, and am doing the same for the RV-8 project that is almost done.

While there are always options to trim cost, I offer your estimates fall short of what you will spend. As example for my RV-8:
- Slow build kit
- New engine and prop from Vanís
- Full IFR package (dual SkyView displayed, GTN-650, etc.
- Do my own firewall forward build)
- Do all my wiring and panel build
- Do my own painting

Total cost for just material, $115K.

Carl
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  #17  
Old 12-18-2018, 11:05 AM
mcoyne34 mcoyne34 is offline
 
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: Fort Worth, TX
Posts: 20
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Thereís a RV8 on controller that was listed for $200k. Itís down to $180k now, looks like an awesome airplane. The asking price surprised me
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  #18  
Old 12-18-2018, 11:53 AM
patterson patterson is offline
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Queen Creek AZ
Posts: 441
Thumbs up Van's best design and performance

"here really was only one choice in the end, the RV8, Vans best design ever with style and performance!"

Not wanting to start a war, but RV-4 is my pick
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RV-4 N8ZD Sold
F4 Raider under construction
regular VAF donor despite being exempt
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  #19  
Old 12-18-2018, 11:45 PM
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Snowflake Snowflake is offline
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Victoria, BC, Canada
Posts: 3,363
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Robin8er View Post
Van's are one of the few experimentals that sell for more than their components are worth.
I would correct that to say that they *CAN* sell for more than their components are worth.

I couldn't have built my -6 for the price I paid for it, but I bought it in the middle of the housing market crash... The seller wasn't affected by the crash (real estate-wise), but he wanted to sell for other reasons... and as they say, a low tide lowers all boats.

Good used RV's still show up on the market priced well under the cost to build from time to time... There was just a thread recently talking about $40K RV's, and two or three people posted that they recently found theirs at that price, in fine condition.

Not everyone wants (or needs) a showplane, dual 10" glass panels, IFR, etc. Many are content with a solid, basic VFR aircraft that has the potential for upgrades later on when/if desired.
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Rob Prior
1996 RV-6 "Tweety" C-FRBP (formerly N196RV)
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  #20  
Old 12-19-2018, 09:33 AM
vlittle's Avatar
vlittle vlittle is offline
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Victoria, Canada
Posts: 2,066
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Snowflake View Post
I would correct that to say that they *CAN* sell for more than their components are worth.

I couldn't have built my -6 for the price I paid for it, but I bought it in the middle of the housing market crash... The seller wasn't affected by the crash (real estate-wise), but he wanted to sell for other reasons... and as they say, a low tide lowers all boats.

Good used RV's still show up on the market priced well under the cost to build from time to time... There was just a thread recently talking about $40K RV's, and two or three people posted that they recently found theirs at that price, in fine condition.

Not everyone wants (or needs) a showplane, dual 10" glass panels, IFR, etc. Many are content with a solid, basic VFR aircraft that has the potential for upgrades later on when/if desired.
I hate to agree with Rob in public, but my next plane is going to have a much simpler panel/electrical system. After flying with a dual EFIS +GPS+iPad in my Rocket, I realize that about 90% of the features are unutilized in VFR flight. I've even turned on six-pack mode on my EFIS and ditched the iPad.

Some EFIS vendors are catching on that simpler, cheaper offerings have greater longevity because the feature sets focus on the essentials and not geegaws.

So a basic VFR panel is not a deficiency, it's a feature! The only exception is that some kind of autopilot could save your life one day.

V
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