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Glass panel -vs- Sunglasses
- Thread starter Adam
- Start date
L.Adamson
Well Known Member
Just wondering if the "regular" glasses you refer to, are "clear" prescription. In my case, I use glasses for far away objects. But it's always made the panel less clear, than with no glasses at all. I had some bi-focals made for this purpose several years ago, but didn't use them in the plane until I lost a lens out of my prescription sunglasses a few weeks ago.
I don't have "glass" for a panel, but I do have a Garmin 696. With the bi-focals, everything looks great. I glance at the panel or the Garmin, and everything is crystal clear. I look straight ahead, and it's all sharp too. Now I wonder why I didn't use these much sooner.
L.Adamson
N941WR
Legacy Member
Most anything non-polarized will do.
I checked the www.ray-ban.com web site looking for glasses that weren't polarized and then bought them locally.
That made all the difference in the world.
jetjok
Well Known Member
Revo (non-polarized) is what I wear for work and pleasure flying.
Ah, the debate will rage endlessly.
I for one LOVE the polarized glasses. Yes, at certain head tilt angles I can "blank out" my EFIS or a small section of the plexi - but it is OBVIOUS. Solution? Tilt your head back where it was. If the BAD angle is "head straight and level," try different glasses.
The advantage of polarized comes when flying in any sort of haze, which is nearly 100% of the time in Georgia. I will pick up traffic 50% further away with the polarized lenses, and in reduced visibility I can usually get similar distance gains watching for towers & terrain.
Amber tint is almost mandatory - gives the very best contrast against almost all sky conditions. Gray tint on a gray day will simply reduce your sight distance - baad!
It's like any other system on your airplane - you need to know the capabilities and limitations and, thus armed, make your personal decision.
I for one LOVE the polarized glasses. Yes, at certain head tilt angles I can "blank out" my EFIS or a small section of the plexi - but it is OBVIOUS. Solution? Tilt your head back where it was. If the BAD angle is "head straight and level," try different glasses.
The advantage of polarized comes when flying in any sort of haze, which is nearly 100% of the time in Georgia. I will pick up traffic 50% further away with the polarized lenses, and in reduced visibility I can usually get similar distance gains watching for towers & terrain.
Amber tint is almost mandatory - gives the very best contrast against almost all sky conditions. Gray tint on a gray day will simply reduce your sight distance - baad!
It's like any other system on your airplane - you need to know the capabilities and limitations and, thus armed, make your personal decision.
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Bill Wightman
Well Known Member
I've sampled almost all possible combinations of sunglass in various Boeing and GA cockpits. The differences are significant between manufacturers, and types. I've used Oakley, Serengetti, Maui Jim, Ray Ban, and el-cheapo plastic types alot. The best lenses on earth are Maui Jim, IMHO.
Putting style aside, here's what I know:
Polarized glasses will blank out LCD displays if viewed at certain angles. They also play games with heated windscreens. I do like wearing them during cruise at high altitude because the polarized lenses seem to produce less eye fatigue over long flights (8+ hours). Depending on what you're plane has for cockpit displays, polarized lenses may or may not work. You'll have to try each pair on and see. Not all polarized lenses behave the same way.
Glass -vs- plastic lenses: Generally, glass lenses out perform plastic. I use glass most of the time (Maui Jim, Serengetti) but plastic is OK too if its of good quality. I HATE gray plastic lenses though.
Color: Bronze lenses seem to give me the best contrast when looking at LCD's. Among the best are Serengetti... they're absolutely the best when looking at a high contrast LCD. Ray Ban is ok too.
The worst? Anything with a cheap plastic non polarized gray lens. Forget it. Even many of the $100+ Oakley lenses are junk IMHO.
What I use: Serengetti when conditions warrant... Maui Jim high contrast bronze double polarized for cruise on long flights. Yes, I have to hold my head right, but it saves the eyeballs!
Putting style aside, here's what I know:
Polarized glasses will blank out LCD displays if viewed at certain angles. They also play games with heated windscreens. I do like wearing them during cruise at high altitude because the polarized lenses seem to produce less eye fatigue over long flights (8+ hours). Depending on what you're plane has for cockpit displays, polarized lenses may or may not work. You'll have to try each pair on and see. Not all polarized lenses behave the same way.
Glass -vs- plastic lenses: Generally, glass lenses out perform plastic. I use glass most of the time (Maui Jim, Serengetti) but plastic is OK too if its of good quality. I HATE gray plastic lenses though.
Color: Bronze lenses seem to give me the best contrast when looking at LCD's. Among the best are Serengetti... they're absolutely the best when looking at a high contrast LCD. Ray Ban is ok too.
The worst? Anything with a cheap plastic non polarized gray lens. Forget it. Even many of the $100+ Oakley lenses are junk IMHO.
What I use: Serengetti when conditions warrant... Maui Jim high contrast bronze double polarized for cruise on long flights. Yes, I have to hold my head right, but it saves the eyeballs!
sonny junell
Well Known Member
I can't afford Maui Jim but most of the line pilots I fly with use them, and love em, we have EFIS in all of our planes and you have to get about 45' of head angle before the screen blanks out, unless you fly a lear they will be fine.
sonny junell
Well Known Member
Peter.Fruehling
Well Known Member
The highest quality non-polorized glass I've found for the money is Serengeti. I've flown with everything from Revo's to Ray Ban's and in terms of quality and value Serengeti is tops!
...yeah $150 some odd dollars is a lot for a pair of sun glasses but the first time you fly with the bronze lens you'll chuck your stylish Ray Ban aviators in to the baggage compartment. (I still have my Ray Ban's but don't fly them anymore)
Here is the dealer I buy from: http://www.ej-sunglasses.com/
He is a good guy and usually offers a 20% discount off full retail...like you would pay at Sunglass hut.
- Peter
...yeah $150 some odd dollars is a lot for a pair of sun glasses but the first time you fly with the bronze lens you'll chuck your stylish Ray Ban aviators in to the baggage compartment. (I still have my Ray Ban's but don't fly them anymore)
Here is the dealer I buy from: http://www.ej-sunglasses.com/
He is a good guy and usually offers a 20% discount off full retail...like you would pay at Sunglass hut.
- Peter
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I have dual Dynons and have had great luck with VedaloHD glasses.
http://www.vedalohd.com/segment.aspx?id=1
Be sure to get models with thin temples or your headsets will suddenly sound really loud!
http://www.vedalohd.com/segment.aspx?id=1
Be sure to get models with thin temples or your headsets will suddenly sound really loud!
revenson
Well Known Member
Hazebuster
You want non-polarized for two reasons: one, you want to see the reflected glare off the wing of traffic, and two, polarization can interfere with some of the new glass panels. There are also other factors to consider.
I haven't seen Hazebuster mentioned, so have to put in a plug. I was attracted to Hazebuster Aviation Sunglasses because of their bifocals. I picked up a pair at Oshkosh, and have been a fan ever since. (So much so, I'm now working with them).
The Hazebuster 'Total Vision Aviation Lens' is available in all three lens materials. They are relatively inexpensive, the quality is great, and have good customer support with a 90 day money back. As far as I know, we are the only sunglass company dedicated solely to the aviation market.
Here are a couple of references on aviation sunglasses from the American Optometric Association and the FAA:
http://aoa.org/x5349.xml
http://www.faa.gov/pilots/safety/pilotsafetybrochures/media/sunglasses.pdf
Hope to see you at some of the shows this season.
Roger Evenson, 7A finishing, Tucson
Hazebuster Aviation Sunglasses
You want non-polarized for two reasons: one, you want to see the reflected glare off the wing of traffic, and two, polarization can interfere with some of the new glass panels. There are also other factors to consider.
I haven't seen Hazebuster mentioned, so have to put in a plug. I was attracted to Hazebuster Aviation Sunglasses because of their bifocals. I picked up a pair at Oshkosh, and have been a fan ever since. (So much so, I'm now working with them).
The Hazebuster 'Total Vision Aviation Lens' is available in all three lens materials. They are relatively inexpensive, the quality is great, and have good customer support with a 90 day money back. As far as I know, we are the only sunglass company dedicated solely to the aviation market.
Here are a couple of references on aviation sunglasses from the American Optometric Association and the FAA:
http://aoa.org/x5349.xml
http://www.faa.gov/pilots/safety/pilotsafetybrochures/media/sunglasses.pdf
Hope to see you at some of the shows this season.
Roger Evenson, 7A finishing, Tucson
Hazebuster Aviation Sunglasses
n5lp
fugio ergo sum
Thank you, thank you, thank you, Roger. I have been mostly flying with no sunglasses since last October, when I lost my non-polarized clip-ons at LOE. I did a lot of internet searching, posted to this website and consulted with local opticians and could find no source for non-polarized clip-ons. I figured it would only take me a few seconds to check the Hazebuster website but didn't expect to find what I needed, but Voila, there it is. My order is in!
revenson
Well Known Member
Thanks Larry.
Sometimes clip-ons can be hard to fit 'virtually', that is, without your glasses present. So make sure if you have any problem with your fit, you call Tonya for help. She will take care of you.
Roger, 7A finishing, Tucson
Hazebuster Aviation Sunglasses
Sometimes clip-ons can be hard to fit 'virtually', that is, without your glasses present. So make sure if you have any problem with your fit, you call Tonya for help. She will take care of you.
Roger, 7A finishing, Tucson
Hazebuster Aviation Sunglasses
db1yg
Well Known Member
Another great source for sunglasses--prescription or non-prescription is :
Hidalgo's--800-786-2021 and ask for a catalog. He does not, last I looked, have a web site but his catalog not only lists his frames and lens types but is a great education on why certain types of lens are better for various activities--to include aviation. They have been providing aviation glasses for 40 years and I have had very good luck with this company. They will send you sample lens and/or frames to try out prior to purchase. After testing several sample lens/frame combos, I opted for their non-polorized dark grey lens but they also have a bronze "Kontraster" lens that also works well for flying. They tell me that most of their flying customers choose the Kontraster because it not only reduces glare and blocks UV, but increases contrast. By filtering out more blue light it makes things look more vivid--it reduces the efect of haze and smoke in the atmosphere to make it easier to spot other airplanes.
They also have non-polarized clip ons and can make up prescription glasses.
Cheers,
db
Hidalgo's--800-786-2021 and ask for a catalog. He does not, last I looked, have a web site but his catalog not only lists his frames and lens types but is a great education on why certain types of lens are better for various activities--to include aviation. They have been providing aviation glasses for 40 years and I have had very good luck with this company. They will send you sample lens and/or frames to try out prior to purchase. After testing several sample lens/frame combos, I opted for their non-polorized dark grey lens but they also have a bronze "Kontraster" lens that also works well for flying. They tell me that most of their flying customers choose the Kontraster because it not only reduces glare and blocks UV, but increases contrast. By filtering out more blue light it makes things look more vivid--it reduces the efect of haze and smoke in the atmosphere to make it easier to spot other airplanes.
They also have non-polarized clip ons and can make up prescription glasses.
Cheers,
db
Hidalgo
I'll second the plug for Hidalgo. I fly with the Kontraster lenses in my perscription sunglasses.
I fly an RV8 with a Dynon and those lenses really help. They actually brighten up the Dynon screen whereas other sunglasses and regular clear lenses do not.
Definately no polarized lenses. Tried them on the ground and certain angles the screen would go blank!!
Clip ons are OK but sometimes you can get a reflection from one lense to the other. I think the key is the amount of gap between the two lenses. Least amount of gap is best. I have a pair of clip ons that I never use flying now because of the reflection thing. By the way, the clip ons I have are the type that are a set from the frame manufacturer, very expensive, not from Hidalgo. Hidalgo did make me a set of Kontraster lenses for them though.
Even if you don't end up buying from him you should call and get his catalog. It does contain some excellent information about glasses.
I get all of my glasses from Hidalgo and very satisfied. My wife tried my Kontrasters one day and now she wears them also.
Just my nickels worth.
Ted
I'll second the plug for Hidalgo. I fly with the Kontraster lenses in my perscription sunglasses.
I fly an RV8 with a Dynon and those lenses really help. They actually brighten up the Dynon screen whereas other sunglasses and regular clear lenses do not.
Definately no polarized lenses. Tried them on the ground and certain angles the screen would go blank!!
Clip ons are OK but sometimes you can get a reflection from one lense to the other. I think the key is the amount of gap between the two lenses. Least amount of gap is best. I have a pair of clip ons that I never use flying now because of the reflection thing. By the way, the clip ons I have are the type that are a set from the frame manufacturer, very expensive, not from Hidalgo. Hidalgo did make me a set of Kontraster lenses for them though.
Even if you don't end up buying from him you should call and get his catalog. It does contain some excellent information about glasses.
I get all of my glasses from Hidalgo and very satisfied. My wife tried my Kontrasters one day and now she wears them also.
Just my nickels worth.
Ted
JC Penny
I found a great pair of non-polarized bi-focal sunglasses at JC Penney's for only $40.00 that work great. Not sure of the brand name, if any. As a fisherman, I know the value of polarization; however, I do not think it is smart to use it with a glass cockpit. I use high dollar polarization fishing glasses (Ocean Waves) everywhere except the airplane. The $40.00 JC Penney glasses rule the flight bag.
I found a great pair of non-polarized bi-focal sunglasses at JC Penney's for only $40.00 that work great. Not sure of the brand name, if any. As a fisherman, I know the value of polarization; however, I do not think it is smart to use it with a glass cockpit. I use high dollar polarization fishing glasses (Ocean Waves) everywhere except the airplane. The $40.00 JC Penney glasses rule the flight bag.
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WillyEyeBall
Well Known Member
A few comments to this thread: In the 60s, we looked at using polaroid lenses for military flying, and found that the stress patterns in the windshields would show up as dark and sometimes colored areas. Therefore, they were never authorized. The LCD displays are also polarized, and are either difficult or impossible to see with polarized lenses. Having said that, I use polarized lenses in my RV-4 with a Dynon EFIS and GPS. See solution:
http://i614.photobucket.com/albums/tt228/willymac104/Polaroidcut-outsunglasses-1.jpg These are the $10 clip-ons you find at Wal-mart. They are optically perfect (part of my job). I don't see any stress patterns in my -4 canopy, and of course, I see very well below the glare shield. The comment about not seeing glint- Reflection other than horizontal are not blocked by the polarization and most glint from aircraft are not purely horizontal. In the case of my RV-4, the curved front part of the canopy actually rotates the polarizing angles such that what I see from the left eye perspective is slightly shifted compared to what is seen from the right eye location. That means if there is glint out there, one of the eyes will see it. Before anyone tries the polaroid clip-ons for flying, may sure you check them out on the ground first looking through your canopy. If all is well, go fly, and if anything doesn't look right upstairs, take them off.
By the way, I tried a gradient visor in my HGU-56/P helmet in the RV and it was better than without a gradient, but not nearly as good as the polaroid clip-ons with the cut-out. I also hated the restricted vision from the helmet, and it almost chocked me when I tried negative Gs.
Hope this helps,
Bill McLean
Research Optometrist
Retired military, retired civil service, and still working
RV-4
http://i614.photobucket.com/albums/tt228/willymac104/Polaroidcut-outsunglasses-1.jpg These are the $10 clip-ons you find at Wal-mart. They are optically perfect (part of my job). I don't see any stress patterns in my -4 canopy, and of course, I see very well below the glare shield. The comment about not seeing glint- Reflection other than horizontal are not blocked by the polarization and most glint from aircraft are not purely horizontal. In the case of my RV-4, the curved front part of the canopy actually rotates the polarizing angles such that what I see from the left eye perspective is slightly shifted compared to what is seen from the right eye location. That means if there is glint out there, one of the eyes will see it. Before anyone tries the polaroid clip-ons for flying, may sure you check them out on the ground first looking through your canopy. If all is well, go fly, and if anything doesn't look right upstairs, take them off.
By the way, I tried a gradient visor in my HGU-56/P helmet in the RV and it was better than without a gradient, but not nearly as good as the polaroid clip-ons with the cut-out. I also hated the restricted vision from the helmet, and it almost chocked me when I tried negative Gs.
Hope this helps,
Bill McLean
Research Optometrist
Retired military, retired civil service, and still working
RV-4
FrankK90989
Well Known Member
Zenni
Got to put in a plug for zenni.com. been wearing glasses for about a thousand years or so. and many a pair of soso shades. Orderd a 80% amber no line prog. pair. They are hands down the best shades for me ever, @ $41.95.
Got to put in a plug for zenni.com. been wearing glasses for about a thousand years or so. and many a pair of soso shades. Orderd a 80% amber no line prog. pair. They are hands down the best shades for me ever, @ $41.95.
hevansrv7a
Well Known Member
Health Concern Re: Polarization
I am only repeating something I was told long ago and I've believed it every since, but can't offer proof. This forum may provide more information on it.
Polarization has the effect of stopping some light - light that is itself polarized for whatever reason. The problem, I was told, is that it fools your iris into staying further open. Of course, if your lens also blocks 100% of all harmful rays, both types of UV included, then perhaps it won't matter.
Any experts willing to clear this up?
I am only repeating something I was told long ago and I've believed it every since, but can't offer proof. This forum may provide more information on it.
Polarization has the effect of stopping some light - light that is itself polarized for whatever reason. The problem, I was told, is that it fools your iris into staying further open. Of course, if your lens also blocks 100% of all harmful rays, both types of UV included, then perhaps it won't matter.
Any experts willing to clear this up?
The Best Glasses
They can be tough to find, but in my experience the high-end Smith glasses are superior (and I have owned most of the brands mentioned so far). Mine are prescription, glass lenses. Smith uses a very high-end production method on their better glasses that wraps the polarization to match the contour of the lens. Virtually no distortion even with my wrap-around style of frame. Their prescription shop is also top notch. Most places if you order prescription lenses for an off the shelf pair of frames, they put their own lenses in, and you may not be getting what you originally paid for in terms of polarization and lens quality. Smith does all of their own lens work. Small company that you can deal with directly and get exactly what you want.
They can be tough to find, but in my experience the high-end Smith glasses are superior (and I have owned most of the brands mentioned so far). Mine are prescription, glass lenses. Smith uses a very high-end production method on their better glasses that wraps the polarization to match the contour of the lens. Virtually no distortion even with my wrap-around style of frame. Their prescription shop is also top notch. Most places if you order prescription lenses for an off the shelf pair of frames, they put their own lenses in, and you may not be getting what you originally paid for in terms of polarization and lens quality. Smith does all of their own lens work. Small company that you can deal with directly and get exactly what you want.
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Yes, the most damaging lenses for your eyes are either gray or polarized (or both) which don't block all UV light.
Beware cheap sunglasses.
Hmm. I bought a pair of non-polarized neutral gray Randolphs some time ago, partly on the basis of being standard issue to various military forces... Now wondering if I should consider a change... Has anyone made the comparison between the brands/tints mentioned in this thread, and my "reference" lenses?
rv9aviator
Well Known Member
Zennioptical
I ordered a pair of prescription sunglasses from zennioptical.com about three weeks ago based on information on the forum. I ordered progressive lenses in 80% bronze tint "non polarized" with Titanium frames. I received them today and have hit a home run. My total cost with shipping was $64.00. For comparison, the same photochromic lenses as my regular glasses would have cost $94.00. I can't tell one bit of difference in this prescription compared to my regular glasses that cost over over $500.00. The main difference was the regular glasses were transitions and these are sunglasses. My eyes are very sensitive to light and driving gave me headaches because the transitions wouldn't darken in the car. I was concerned about the progressive part not working as it should thinking it might start up too high or too low but it is right where the other glasses are and is perfect. The website gives you all the information you need to order from including all the dimensions of the frames. It won't let you order a frame that is too narrow or too wide for the distance between your eyes. That dimension is your prescription,BTW. Whoever posted the information about this company gets a big high five from me. I don't have anything to do with this company, just a satisfied customer.
I ordered a pair of prescription sunglasses from zennioptical.com about three weeks ago based on information on the forum. I ordered progressive lenses in 80% bronze tint "non polarized" with Titanium frames. I received them today and have hit a home run. My total cost with shipping was $64.00. For comparison, the same photochromic lenses as my regular glasses would have cost $94.00. I can't tell one bit of difference in this prescription compared to my regular glasses that cost over over $500.00. The main difference was the regular glasses were transitions and these are sunglasses. My eyes are very sensitive to light and driving gave me headaches because the transitions wouldn't darken in the car. I was concerned about the progressive part not working as it should thinking it might start up too high or too low but it is right where the other glasses are and is perfect. The website gives you all the information you need to order from including all the dimensions of the frames. It won't let you order a frame that is too narrow or too wide for the distance between your eyes. That dimension is your prescription,BTW. Whoever posted the information about this company gets a big high five from me. I don't have anything to do with this company, just a satisfied customer.
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I received a pm about my post - it seems my wording may not have been as precise as it might.
MOST (if not all) sunglasses today protect against UV - they should be clearly labeled.
However, if you find and buy a cheap set of sunglasses that do NOT provide full protection from UV, THEN gray lenses are the "worst" because they will cause your pupils to dilate more than just about any other color - thus tricking your eye into letting in gobs of damaging UV light.
20 years ago, "cheap gray sunglasses" were frequently found on dime store racks. It may well be that these have been regulated out of existence.
There is no other inherent risk (that I am aware of) simply because the tint is gray as long as they are full UV blocking lenses - however, I would still recommend amber / copper lenses over gray because they provide superior contrast in flight and in haze.
So - my warning should have read:
"Stay away from gray lens sunglasses unless they are clearly labeled to provide full protection from UV light. Those lenses in particular will allow your eye to dilate more than other colors, letting in more damaging UV."
Sorry for any misunderstandings...
aparchment
Well Known Member
Hmmm
I have heard this rationale used a bunch to counter the use of polarized sunglasses, and it doesn't resonate with me. If I am squinting because the glare outside is so bad, my likelihood of seeing that other traffic is significantly diminished anyway. I will wear my Maui Jim polarized sunglasses and rely on the improved vision to spot that other plane (plus my TIS ;-) and ATC)
I have heard this rationale used a bunch to counter the use of polarized sunglasses, and it doesn't resonate with me. If I am squinting because the glare outside is so bad, my likelihood of seeing that other traffic is significantly diminished anyway. I will wear my Maui Jim polarized sunglasses and rely on the improved vision to spot that other plane (plus my TIS ;-) and ATC)
az_gila
Well Known Member
Glider pilots...
...like this polarized/orange combination too.
Seeing the haze is good since "lumps" in the haze are thermals...
Some pilots found that their canopies caused their polarized lens to be useless - the dark black band directly ahead is not conducive to safety - but these particular planes seemed to be in the minority.
Buy some cheap polarized clip ons and do a test, if it's OK through the canopy, and you can still see the LCD displays on your instruments, go for it.
IIRC, some shooters also use the orange tint to get increased contrast against the sky - but if you wear them driving your car, the traffic light colors get screwed up...
UPDATE
The original 80's ones I mentioned for glider pilots were called SunTigers, and was a NASA spin-off -
http://www.techbriefs.com/component/content/article/1273
The company is still in business as Eagle Eyes.
...like this polarized/orange combination too.
Seeing the haze is good since "lumps" in the haze are thermals...
Some pilots found that their canopies caused their polarized lens to be useless - the dark black band directly ahead is not conducive to safety - but these particular planes seemed to be in the minority.
Buy some cheap polarized clip ons and do a test, if it's OK through the canopy, and you can still see the LCD displays on your instruments, go for it.
IIRC, some shooters also use the orange tint to get increased contrast against the sky - but if you wear them driving your car, the traffic light colors get screwed up...
UPDATE
The original 80's ones I mentioned for glider pilots were called SunTigers, and was a NASA spin-off -
http://www.techbriefs.com/component/content/article/1273
The company is still in business as Eagle Eyes.
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vedalo
Well, I got some Vedalo's and I really like them. But it is still hard to see the glass panel with them on. I found a great deal on "last year's models" and thought I'd share.
http://www.sportsmansguide.com/net/...ium-rosso-sunglasses-green-lens.aspx?a=532894
Well, I got some Vedalo's and I really like them. But it is still hard to see the glass panel with them on. I found a great deal on "last year's models" and thought I'd share.
http://www.sportsmansguide.com/net/...ium-rosso-sunglasses-green-lens.aspx?a=532894
