PH Aviation Flap Actuator Install in a RV-7

Yesterday I finished the installation of a PH Aviation flap actuator. This is a short post of the fabrication and installation process. As the website states, it's not a direct replacement. But it was easy nonetheless

I first learned about this new actuator by reading this thread on VAF.
Here's the website where I purchased the actuator. First thing I did was email Pat Hatch with some questions. Pat answered really fast and was easy to communicate with.

So the installation... Pat's instructions were for a RV-6. After looking the plans over, I decided the edge distance for the pivot bolt hole in the bracket was a little too skinny for my tastes. So I did a little redesign.

I basically used some of the methods Van's uses for their actuator and combined that with the RV-6 plans...shook it up a little and came out with a nice installation. I kept the geometry the same as the plans for the -6, so I didn't have to reinvent the wheel and could use the rest of their plan guidelines.



Just to get orientated, here's a photo from Pat's website showing the difference between the Van's installation compared to theirs.
Pat's is on the right, Van's on the left.





Here's a photo of my assembly laid out with all the parts in the proper orientation. You can see I modified the brackets and eliminated any concern for edge distance. I also made my brackets the same length as Van's. This allowed me to use three rivets and as a bonus the sides of the brackets are secured. Pat's design uses shims to keep the bracket bottoms level with the F-767 attach angle. I just lengthened the F-767 since I hadn't fabricated it yet.





Here's the whole affair assembled.





Another view.





Here's a short video of me checking out the geometry in action. My bearing blocks were a little tight so you can hear the motor pitch changing as the friction went up and down...bearing blocks smooth now


It was an easy installation and I'm excited to see it work in the air.

Your installation looks great Michael. I?m also incorporating Pat?s flap actuator into my build and I?m going to follow your lead on making F-767 longer and making the attach angles like you did.

Mark

Mark33 said:

Your installation looks great Michael. I?m also incorporating Pat?s flap actuator into my build and I?m going to follow your lead on making F-767 longer and making the attach angles like you did.

Mark

Click to expand...

Thanks for the kind words.

Pat's flap actuator should be a nice upgrade to the -7. Having internal limit switches and internal position sensing is great.

Pat recommended this flap switch . It's a sustained up, spring down switch...flip up and forget about it, no holding it until the flaps are up. Plus the toggle won't rotate so you can add a flap shaped handle like this one and it will stay in the proper position.

I?m using the Garmin GAD-27 in my build and one of its functions is flap control. Stein is already installing a 1TL1-7 (on)off(on)...momentary in both directions...toggle switch for the flap deployment, so I?m hoping that the flaps will retract fully with one flip up of this switch....even though it is momentary. I?ll double check with Stein to make sure the 1TL1-7 will do the trick while working with the GAD-27. I?ll also contact Pat to confirm with him weather or not the 1TL1-7 will work with my setup and his flap motor. I definitely want the flaps to retract completely with just one flip of the switch and not to have to hold the switch. I know that the GAD-27 will deploy the flaps and stop them at the number of stops and whatever degrees you may want them to stop at, by I?m not 100% certain about the retract part.

Mark33 said:

I?m using the Garmin GAD-27 in my build and one of its functions is flap control. Stein is already installing a 1TL1-7 (on)off(on)...momentary in both directions...toggle switch for the flap deployment, so I?m hoping that the flaps will retract fully with one flip up of this switch....even though it is momentary. I?ll double check with Stein to make sure the 1TL1-7 will do the trick while working with the GAD-27. I?ll also contact Pat to confirm with him weather or not the 1TL1-7 will work with my setup and his flap motor. I definitely want the flaps to retract completely with just one flip of the switch and not to have to hold the switch. I know that the GAD-27 will deploy the flaps and stop them at the number of stops and whatever degrees you may want them to stop at, by I?m not 100% certain about the retract part.

Click to expand...

I don't think the momentary both direction sw will do what you want but you may want to check with G3xpert to be sure.

The following is from the G3X manual pretty well describes the action:

Optional flap limit switches can also be used with the GAD 27, which will cause the flap motor to stop upon reaching the extreme ends of its travel.
If the flap switch is held longer than 1 second, the flaps will run in the specified direction until the flap switch is released or the flap limit switch is triggered. This method of manually moving the flaps is not affected by user-defined airspeed limits. This behavior can also be used in conjunction with a nonmomentary switch in order to fully retract the flaps with a single pilot action. Note that if any of the preprogrammed flap positions are negative (i.e. "reflexed") the flaps will still stop at the pre-programmed "zero" position during manual flap retraction.

Walt said:

I don't think the momentary both direction sw will do what you want but you may want to check with G3xpert to be sure.

The following is from the G3X manual pretty well describes the action:

Optional flap limit switches can also be used with the GAD 27, which will cause the flap motor to stop upon reaching the extreme ends of its travel.
If the flap switch is held longer than 1 second, the flaps will run in the specified direction until the flap switch is released or the flap limit switch is triggered. This method of manually moving the flaps is not affected by user-defined airspeed limits. This behavior can also be used in conjunction with a nonmomentary switch in order to fully retract the flaps with a single pilot action. Note that if any of the preprogrammed flap positions are negative (i.e. "reflexed") the flaps will still stop at the pre-programmed "zero" position during manual flap retraction.

Click to expand...

Hmmmm....interesting. I actually sent Pat an email asking him about this and he told me that the 1TL1-7 (momentary both directions) is the proper switch to use if also using the GAD-27. I?ll also confirm this with Stein and Garmin.

I'll defer to the Garmin experts, but according to the manual you can pre-program up to 8 predetermined flap positions.

This is from the manual:

Flap Controller
The Flap Controller interfaces directly to the flap motor and uses flap position measured by the GEA 24 from an external position sensor to support up to 8 pre-programmed flap settings. The GAD 27 can automatically move the flaps between pre-programmed positions in response to a momentary press of the flap control switch by the pilot. Each momentary press of the flap switch causes the flaps to move by one step in the specified direction, stopping at the next pre-programmed position.

Note the reference to "each momentary press of the flap switch causes the flaps to move by one step in the specified direction." This would seem to imply that if you bump the flap switch up from flaps full down, it will go all the way up to the zero position if you have set it up that way. Then if you want to go one more step up to the reflex position of -3° (for the RV-10), you would bump it one more time. My interpretation of this is that if you want to have the reflex capability in the RV-10, you would need the momentary switch for the up position.

Mark33 said:

I?m using the Garmin GAD-27 in my build and one of its functions is flap control. Stein is already installing a 1TL1-7 (on)off(on)...momentary in both directions...toggle switch for the flap deployment, so I?m hoping that the flaps will retract fully with one flip up of this switch....even though it is momentary. I?ll double check with Stein to make sure the 1TL1-7 will do the trick while working with the GAD-27. I?ll also contact Pat to confirm with him weather or not the 1TL1-7 will work with my setup and his flap motor. I definitely want the flaps to retract completely with just one flip of the switch and not to have to hold the switch. I know that the GAD-27 will deploy the flaps and stop them at the number of stops and whatever degrees you may want them to stop at, by I?m not 100% certain about the retract part.

Click to expand...

Hello Mark,

You don't say how many flap positions you plan, but let's assume for this discussion that your RV-7 will be configured like our RV-7A to have zero, partial, and full flap positions.

Let's discuss how your system will work with momentary up and momentary down control.

When you are coming in to land, and get slowed down below partial flaps speed, just bump the down switch and it goes automatically to the partial flaps position. Further into the landing, if you want full flaps, just bump the down switch again and it automatically goes to full flaps.

Now, lets say you want to go missed and retract the flaps to the partial position immediately, with full retraction later. Just bump the up momentary switch and the flaps will automatically move to the partial flaps position and stop. Bumping the up switch again causes full flap retraction.

Now lets say you land with full flaps, and want to fully retract the flaps. You can do this two ways.

First, if you bump the momentary up switch twice, you are done and the flaps will retract fully without stopping in the partial position.

You can also just hold (instead of bump) the momentary up switch and manually retract the flaps fully.

If you don't like what you just read for retracting the flaps, you can always install a momentary down, sustained up switch. When it comes time to retract the flaps fully, just flip the switch. This does, however, partially remove the nice feature to bump the up switch to retract to the partial position. You can actually do this with the sustained up switch by flipping up, then quickly back to center, but it is not nearly as satisfying as using the bump up momentary switch (in my opinion).

Thanks,
Steve

g3xpert said:

Hello Mark,

You don't say how many flap positions you plan, but let's assume for this discussion that your RV-7 will be configured like our RV-7A to have zero, partial, and full flap positions.

Let's discuss how your system will work with momentary up and momentary down control.

When you are coming in to land, and get slowed down below partial flaps speed, just bump the down switch and it goes automatically to the partial flaps position. Further into the landing, if you want full flaps, just bump the down switch again and it automatically goes to full flaps.

Now, lets say you want to go missed and retract the flaps to the partial position immediately, with full retraction later. Just bump the up momentary switch and the flaps will automatically move to the partial flaps position and stop. Bumping the up switch again causes full flap retraction.

Now lets say you land with full flaps, and want to fully retract the flaps. You can do this two ways.

First, if you bump the momentary up switch twice, you are done and the flaps will retract fully without stopping in the partial position.

You can also just hold (instead of bump) the momentary up switch and manually retract the flaps fully.

If you don't like what you just read for retracting the flaps, you can always install a momentary down, sustained up switch. When it comes time to retract the flaps fully, just flip the switch. This does, however, partially remove the nice feature to bump the up switch to retract to the partial position. You can actually do this with the sustained up switch by flipping up, then quickly back to center, but it is not nearly as satisfying as using the bump up momentary switch (in my opinion).

Thanks,
Steve

Click to expand...

Thanks Steve for the detailed explanation! If a quick ?two bump up? will retract the flaps completely, than that seems to be a pretty simple maneuver...with still having the option to stop the retraction at the specified position points if you so choose.

I think this new actuator with built in position sensors and limit switches, combined with the GAD27 controller is a great combo, one of these days when I have time I plan on upgrading my own 7 to this setup.

I ordered and received mine last week. I can't wait to get it installed. I have spent many more hours than I will admit to trying to make the RA sensor work with my VP system and G3X. The bonus will be not having to clean the grease I understand can be an issue.

Pat was great to deal with.

Mark33 said:

Thanks Steve for the detailed explanation! If a quick ?two bump up? will retract the flaps completely, than that seems to be a pretty simple maneuver...with still having the option to stop the retraction at the specified position points if you so choose.

Click to expand...

You are welcome Mark. We actually have the momentary down, sustained up flap switch on our RV-7A, and after having flown it for several years, I personally would rather have momentary contact switches for both up and down. More flexibility, and I like the consistency in both directions.

I find it to be a workload reducer to always use the automation to accurately re-position the flaps, both up and down.

Thanks,
Steve

Just thinking outloud here, would there be a way to install a 3 pos switch to get the 3 desired flap settings, ie: UP/MID/DWN.
This would act more like a typical flap selector then merely a toggle sw.
Or how about a Rotary flap selector switch, then you could have UP/15/30/40 with minimal panel space.

Boeing Alt flap selector: