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Mobile wing work stand?

N546RV

N546RV

Well Known Member
So here I am, continuing the task of getting ready to receive my wing kit. I just spent the weekend cleaning and reorganizing the garage so I can actually have room to build the wings and store all the parts that will be arriving soon.

Now I'm thinking about the wing stand. The understanding I have from reading around is that the "standard" stand design involved a couple of 4x4 posts secured to the floor and the ceiling. This design poses a couple of issues for me:
  • With three motorcycles in the garage, I pretty much have no choice but to orient the wing stand from front to back in the garage, and thus the garage door interferes with the overhead
  • Between the aforementioned motorcycles and the double set of tools that results from having another mechanically inclined housemate, it would be preferable to have a stand that can be moved around if need be

My understanding is also that for a prepunch kit like the -8, the absolute squareness and stability of this stand are not as vital as with the older kits. (hence my use of the "stand" terminology instead of "jig")

With all that in mind, I've been mulling over building a mobile stand. I definitely would like for it to be at least freestanding. Assuming the stand was built sturdily, with good diagonal corner bracing and such, is this going to to provide a stiff enough stand for building my wings? What are the potential issues with doing this, and what can I do to mitigate them as I design this thing?

My general idea is to have an inverted T shape for each end piece. These would be tied together with a 2x6 at top and bottom, parallel to the spars. Then I'd have 2x6s (or maybe 2x4s) that would run under the wing on each side, where I'd have a spot to support the center of the rear spare to keep the wings straight.

Thoughts?
 
Hi Philip-

I did exactly as you described and this setup worked very well with full swivel wheels attached to the base. Of course there will be some initial sag in the middle, but I just supported the rear spar with a short 2x4 from spar to ground. As I clecoed the skins, it pretty much self adjusted the alignment perfectly and the short 2x4 could be removed. Actually the 2x4 would usually fall down as the skin, ribs and spars aligned with the pre-punched holes. Was very rigid once all clecoed together. Just needed to remember to re-install the short 2x4 when taking the skins off after drilling.

This setup worked great given the limited work space, I could easily move the wings out of the corner to work on them and put back when done.

I attached a pic for you.
a>
 
Dbro172 said:
some examples on my build log. - no regrets.

http://www.mykitlog.com/users/displ...&project=2102&category=7714&log=151639&row=51

http://www.mykitlog.com/users/displ...&project=2102&category=7714&log=152429&row=39
Click to expand...

Very nice. I do have a question though...I did some wing stand research today (on my lunch break of course...*cough*) and one thing I saw mentioned was needing to get to the "backside" of the wing during construction. With your setup, did you just pull the wing structure and turn it around when you needed to work on the bottom? If so, did this ever get annoying?

I had another thought during/after my research session...I saw the stands Rudi Greyling built for his -7, which consisted of a separate stand for each wing. That setup definitely make it possible to work on the top or bottom of the wing without any repositioning, which seems nice. That, in turn, got me to think about building two stands, each of hich would hold only one wing. Basically like Rudi's setup, only mounted on a rolling base instead of bolted to the floor.

The positive side of that idea is the ability to work on both sides of the wing easily, and still be able to roll the stands closer together when not wokring to save space in the shop. The downside, of course, is that now I have to build two stands instead of one. (well, if I'm building both wings at once, that is...)

How much of a pain is it to not have ready access to both sides of the wing? Did you have to do a lot of switching around? I'm trying to talk the pseudo-engineer side of myself out of making this stand project unnecessarily complicated...

:rolleyes:

Thanks!
 
Yet another example...

Hi Philip

I am sure Ron Duren won't mind if I patch you in to his solution, even if it is an RV-7! His rolling stand is shown here

I have to give Ron due credit, being that he is about 1 week away from moving his bird from the garage to the hangar. Totally jealous I am!

As for me, I am following the Rudi Greiling method, since I was fortunate to find someone that could weld them together for me. I am right in the middle of that process as I write this. In fact, when I am done, I will be out to the garage to drill some more mounting holes in the base.

You can go back a few posts and read about the welding experience if you wish, but the latest post is here
 
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N546RV said:
Very nice. I do have a question though...I did some wing stand research today (on my lunch break of course...*cough*) and one thing I saw mentioned was needing to get to the "backside" of the wing during construction. With your setup, did you just pull the wing structure and turn it around when you needed to work on the bottom? If so, did this ever get annoying?

I had another thought during/after my research session...I saw the stands Rudi Greyling built for his -7, which consisted of a separate stand for each wing. That setup definitely make it possible to work on the top or bottom of the wing without any repositioning, which seems nice. That, in turn, got me to think about building two stands, each of hich would hold only one wing. Basically like Rudi's setup, only mounted on a rolling base instead of bolted to the floor.

The positive side of that idea is the ability to work on both sides of the wing easily, and still be able to roll the stands closer together when not wokring to save space in the shop. The downside, of course, is that now I have to build two stands instead of one. (well, if I'm building both wings at once, that is...)

How much of a pain is it to not have ready access to both sides of the wing? Did you have to do a lot of switching around? I'm trying to talk the pseudo-engineer side of myself out of making this stand project unnecessarily complicated...

:rolleyes:

Thanks!
Click to expand...

I researched the **** out of this leading up to my wing kit delivery...


It's a mute point. Yes you need to flip the wings but not too often. I built my wings in about 3-4 months and my wife helped me flip the wings whenever needed. and she was up to about 8 months pregnant at the time.;). It's literally, "hey honey, lets flip the wings..." 1 minute later she's back to doing what she does!

I also used this same stand to rivet the top and bottom skins and install the fuel tanks.

I had all thread to adjust the twist, just like Rudy's. I used fishing line to check twist. Neither stand was anchored to the floor. My wings have a 1/16" or less twist, probably 1/32".

I could also move the entire loaded rack (one end at a time) when needed. It keeps things nice and close and less confusing. Like I said, no regrets. You could borrow mine..... But we're at opposite ends:eek:
 
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No wheels for me.

Flyin'Bryan said:
Hi Philip

I am sure Ron Duren won't mind if I patch you in to his solution, even if it is an RV-7! His rolling stand is shown here

I have to give Ron due credit, being that he is about 1 week away from moving his bird from the garage to the hangar. Totally jealous I am!

As for me, I am following the Rudi Greiling method, since I was fortunate to find someone that could weld them together for me. I am right in the middle of that process as I write this. In fact, when I am done, I will be out to the garage to drill some more mounting holes in the base.

You can go back a few posts and read about the welding experience if you wish, but the latest post is here
Click to expand...



IMHO - I would not want my wing stand on wheels, unless they have good brakes and won't slide. When you get to screwing the tanks to platenuts, countersinking, or riveting, your "leaning in to it" quite a bit. Wings don't weigh much and it's not hard to move the whole rack even without wheels.
 
Dbro172 said:
I researched the **** out of this leading up to my wing kit delivery...


It's a mute point. Yes you need to flip the wings but not too often. I built my wings in about 3-4 months and my wife helped me flip the wings whenever needed. and she was up to about 8 months pregnant at the time.;). It's literally, "hey honey, lets flip the wings..." 1 minute later she's back to doing what she does!

I also used this same stand to rivet the top and bottom skins and install the fuel tanks.

I had all thread to adjust the twist, just like Rudy's. I used fishing line to check twist. Neither stand was anchored to the floor. My wings have a 1/16" or less twist, probably 1/32".

I could also move the entire loaded rack (one end at a time) when needed. It keeps things nice and close and less confusing. Like I said, no regrets. You could borrow mine..... But we're at opposite ends:eek:
Click to expand...

Good deal, now I'm convinced not to go crazy and build two rolling single-wing stands. One compact one for both should be a lot simpler, and since I have a partner to recruit for wing-flipping, that won't be a problem.

I'm still kind of torn on adding wheels. It may be necessary for me to be able to roll the stand in and out of position when I start and end a work day. I don't want to block the bikes in the garage. I'll probably start by building it without wheels, and if it looks like mobility will be a neccesity, I can always add them later.
 
You can install casters or wheels on one end only,positioned so you have to tip up jig slightly from opposite end to move.....Tomcatrv4
 
VAF to the rescue yet again. It seems that every time I start really puzzling over something, there's a VAF thread started at exactly the right time. :) Told my wife the other day that my $25 for this site has been just as useful as any tool I've bought.

I am coming close to having my empennage complete, and was just thinking yesterday about this. The guy I bought the kit from had a wing stand bolted to the floor and screwed to the ceiling. I got his wing stands, but they're a little short for my garage -- plus due to the layout it would be difficult to anchor them top & bottom. I'd been wondering if I could modify the stands to make them self-supporting and possibly mobile, but didn't know if that was a crazy idea or not. I don't want to do something that's going to end up with wings that aren't built right. It looks like I could do something very similar to Ron's solution -- the ends are already built, I just need to shorten them and go from there.
 
Dollies under wind stands

One comment on the rolling stands. I found the the locking casters on my rolling EAA workbench are sometimes not enough friction to stop movement of the bench if I'm really pushing on it.

For my wing stands, I used Harbor Freight furniture dollies designed to go under each leg. That way I could just lift the stand and kick the dollies out from under when I was ready to work. Otherwise it is a great space saver to have the stands on wheels.

The feet, which are obscured in the lower picture, are setting in the dollie's recess and can be adjusted for level using the wingnut.

P1000650.JPG


P1000648.JPG
 
Philip-
I have have rudy greyling type stands that I should be done with (at least one set) in about a month (hopefully)... You have a 100+ hours of work before you really need the wing stand. I'm in Lawrenceville so, if you want to bum, borrow or buy them, you are more than welcome to use them. Match drilling the concrete floor is is the hardest part :mad:.... I have all the drill bits etc. Check out my log under wing stand if you want to check them out or stop by.
 
On the wing stands that I'm still thinking about, I'm planning to Bondo them to the concrete floor. The stands will have adjustment screws and that's what'll get Bondo'd to the floor.

It worked for the empennage jig. I had to do that after I accidentally pushed it and it went out of alignment.

Dave
 
Daniel S. said:
Philip-
I have have rudy greyling type stands that I should be done with (at least one set) in about a month (hopefully)... You have a 100+ hours of work before you really need the wing stand. I'm in Lawrenceville so, if you want to bum, borrow or buy them, you are more than welcome to use them. Match drilling the concrete floor is is the hardest part :mad:.... I have all the drill bits etc. Check out my log under wing stand if you want to check them out or stop by.
Click to expand...

I appreciate the offer, but since I'm building in a rented house, drilling holes in the floor of the garage is off the table. Plus I think a mobile stand of some kind is going to be necessary so everyone can still get their bikes out while I'm working on the wings.

:)
 
Another option for metal stands

At a recent hangar party I saw another solution that was using the metal stands to build the wings in the hangar, where drilling anchors into the nice epoxy floor of the hangar was also taboo. He simply set his metal posts on top of a 2x8 or 2x10 piece of wood, and mounted the bolts from the underside of the wood into the holes in the metal base. This way the stands are not permanently attached to the floor.

I need to firmly affix mine to the garage floor because i don't have very much flat space on my floor to begin with, and I was afraid that wood supports would not be stable enough.

This might still be an issue when attaching the leading edges and tanks as another builder previously mentioned (having to lean into it a bit, etc.), But this is another option if you want to use the metal.
 
Bryan... You're on to something there :D... That was my initial plan but I just ended up drilling into my floor. A mobile "Greyling type" stand would absolutely rock!!! One thing folks dont think about much is really how much of a beating wing stands take. If you make it mobile, make sure you can anchor it some how. You pretty much want to be able to put your weight into it without it moving.:eek:
 
Picture of Wood Mount Metal Wing Stand

Managed to dig up a pic of the stand I mentioned in my previous post, courtesy of Sean Thomas. I did not even notice the long wood cross member half way up the stand until just now. Must be nice to have enough room to be able to line them both up side by side....:(

eref88.jpg


Even nicer to be building those wings right next to a 2010 award winning grand champion RV 8 sitting close by for motivation - Kudos to Jim Gray!

w7io9g.jpg
 
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My mobile wing stand

Here's what I did. 2x4 rectangle steel tube. Angle for cross piece legs and Harbor Freight locking casters. I too didn't have the option to drill into my friend's hangar floor. It works great. First time posting pics so I hope they work.

50b1ce36.jpg


7894f8da.jpg
 
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