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Page 06-02 step 6

iamtheari

Well Known Member
I ordered my RV-14 empennage kit so now it's time to start asking really, really basic questions. On the very first page of the build instructions, it says to "dimple the rivet holes on the aft face of the VS-702 Front Spar and VS-01401 Front Spar Doubler" and then in the associated Figure 4 it says "dimple flush aft." Does this mean to dimple toward the aft or dimple toward the front so the flush side is to the aft? I assume the latter, but I don't want to act on a bad assumption on the very first page of the kit.

I look forward to getting started on the build. Rest assured that I will have more basic questions as I go, and for posterity I will make future builders even more comfortable asking their basic questions since they can't possibly be more basic than mine. :)
 
Bring on the questions!

Typically the manual will say something like "flush aft" or "flush this side".

You'll need to study/read ahead and see how the "assembly" you're working with is put together, it will help clear up the big picture.

Also, and you will do this at some point, if you do dimple the wrong direction you only get 1 re-do to fix it, more than that and the part needs to be replaced. Additional attempts to fixed a reversed dimple will weaken the aluminum.

If you're building consistently you'll have a constant supply of new parts coming from Vans from mistakes, at least for a while. The parts are cheap, shipping can get you if you're on a schedule.

In the case of VS-702 "flush aft" means just that, the aft side of the part will have flush rivets.
 
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It means
dimple toward the front so the flush side is to the aft?

In this case, your going to mate that aft surface to a mounting bracket much much later on, so it needs to be flat.
 
Thanks for the answers. That makes sense and is consistent with what I had understood from the plans. I'll try to come up with another really easy one soon!
 
Aloha

I have consolidated most of the threads on VAF onto the digital plans for the RV-14 so that most of the questions like yours are on the specific page. I have it on a dropbox account. If you are interested in using it I need an email address to give you access. If you don't want to use a main email address feel free to make a new one that you can use for online boards or dispose of in case you start getting too much spam.


You will find this thread as a hyperlink on the bottom R of page 06-02.

Before you dive into the plans start at a minimum at pg 05-34.

pg 05-30 has some additional info.

Most everything else before that is just highlighted stuff w/no changes as of this date.
 
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Aloha

I have consolidated most of the threads on VAF onto the digital plans for the RV-14 so that most of the questions like yours are on the specific page. I have it on a dropbox account. If you are interested in using it I need an email address to give you access. If you don't want to use a main email address feel free to make a new one that you can use for online boards or dispose of in case you start getting too much spam.


You will find this thread as a hyperlink on the bottom R of page 06-02.

Before you dive into the plans start at a minimum at pg 05-34.

pg 05-30 has some additional info.

Most everything else before that is just highlighted stuff w/no changes as of this date.

This is a fantastic resource: I use the links for almost every section and it has saved me some serious headaches.
 
Aloha

I have consolidated most of the threads on VAF onto the digital plans for the RV-14 so that most of the questions like yours are on the specific page. I have it on a dropbox account. If you are interested in using it I need an email address to give you access. If you don't want to use a main email address feel free to make a new one that you can use for online boards or dispose of in case you start getting too much spam.


You will find this thread as a hyperlink on the bottom R of page 06-02.

Before you dive into the plans start at a minimum at pg 05-34.

pg 05-30 has some additional info.

Most everything else before that is just highlighted stuff w/no changes as of this date.
Wow. That is awesome, and a lot of work. I made a spreadsheet, one page per section, one row per step, to keep track of page revision dates, steps completed / incomplete, and time spent on each step. That was enough digital labor, so I can appreciate your effort on doing this. I'll PM you my e-mail address for the Dropbox invitation. Thank you!
 
As a follow-up to this page, if I am priming should I prime the VS-702 and VS-01401 (and, in the general case, other spars and doublers) separately before riveting them together or after riveting?
 
I have seen some builder logs where only the mating surfaces are coated. But that's a subject probably for the primer Wars ;-) I don't have an opinion on it yet just the input.
 
I have seen some builder logs where only the mating surfaces are coated. But that's a subject probably for the primer Wars ;-) I don't have an opinion on it yet just the input.
I have no interest in the primer wars, thankfully. It probably makes no appreciable difference whether I prime the mating surfaces of the spars and spar doublers or just the exposed surfaces after mating the parts, but as long as it's not a thickness concern where two layers of primer cause the vertical stabilizer not to fit onto the airframe, I'll be okay.
 
Actually if you are going to prime I believe that you want the mating surfaces primed first vs just the exposed surfaces. I did see some pictures of mating surfaces that were not primed that had hidden corrosion but do not remember where I saw that. The gist of that subject was with two surfaces held together there is more opportunity for moisture to not be able to dry out. hence the possibility of corrosion. On the flip side its all Alclad aluminum is coated.

This is the answer I got from vans aircraft about QBs

The QBs are primed, then assembled. It would not make any sense to do it the other way as there would be no primer between mated parts.

 
Actually if you are going to prime I believe that you want the mating surfaces primed first vs just the exposed surfaces. I did see some pictures of mating surfaces that were not primed that had hidden corrosion but do not remember where I saw that. The gist of that subject was with two surfaces held together there is more opportunity for moisture to not be able to dry out. hence the possibility of corrosion. On the flip side its all Alclad aluminum is coated.

This is the answer I got from vans aircraft about QBs

The QBs are primed, then assembled. It would not make any sense to do it the other way as there would be no primer between mated parts.


That is the understanding I got from the above. Prime, then join.
 
My kit arrived last Friday and my tool collection has started to grow exponentially. I have to make a trip out of town to get a band saw (or figure out how to make the cut referred to below without one) but pretty much everything else is ready to go.

One curiosity I have, which relates to the band saw and to the first few steps of the kit, is this: Why is the first thing you do on this kit drilling a bunch of fresh holes and cutting off a small portion of the front VS spar? Those could clearly have been done by Van's. Is it an intentional move on their part to get you comfortable drilling new holes and cutting metal right on the first day of the build, or is there another reason behind it?
 
One curiosity I have, which relates to the band saw and to the first few steps of the kit, is this: Why is the first thing you do on this kit drilling a bunch of fresh holes and cutting off a small portion of the front VS spar? Those could clearly have been done by Van's. Is it an intentional move on their part to get you comfortable drilling new holes and cutting metal right on the first day of the build, or is there another reason behind it?

Note that the part # is VS-702
That means the origins of the part are the RV-7 kit, so it get used for more than one model.
That requires a small amount of adjustment (and drilling some holes) depending on which model it is being installed on.
 
Note that the part # is VS-702
That means the origins of the part are the RV-7 kit, so it get used for more than one model.
That requires a small amount of adjustment (and drilling some holes) depending on which model it is being installed on.
Ah, I hadn't thought of that, since the 14 is part of the new part numbering system. I thought it was just for the learnin' and here I got to learn anyhow.
 
Bring on the questions!

In the case of VS-702 "flush aft" means just that, the aft side of the part will have flush rivets.

I'm at the OP's point of construction as well, and your answer answered my own identical question. But I have a follow-on question: The plans say that just 6 of the 10 holes are to be riveted with "flush aft" using AN426AD3-3.5 rivets. The other four holes along the top call for, according to the plans, to be riveted using AN470AD3-3.5 rivets.

I assume those 4 using standard round-head rivets will be riveted in the same direction as the 6 flush rivets, yes? Does it matter? Or is it just good form to rivet all in the same direction?
 
I'm at the OP's point of construction as well, and your answer answered my own identical question. But I have a follow-on question: The plans say that just 6 of the 10 holes are to be riveted with "flush aft" using AN426AD3-3.5 rivets. The other four holes along the top call for, according to the plans, to be riveted using AN470AD3-3.5 rivets.

I assume those 4 using standard round-head rivets will be riveted in the same direction as the 6 flush rivets, yes? Does it matter? Or is it just good form to rivet all in the same direction?
I don't think it matters, but I did them the same direction because then the nice round manufactured head will be the one visible if you peer between the rudder and the vertical stabilizer, instead of the not-so-nice shop head. (The flush rivets will be covered up by the attachment point to the fuselage, but the AN470's will not.)
 
I don't think it matters, but I did them the same direction because then the nice round manufactured head will be the one visible if you peer between the rudder and the vertical stabilizer, instead of the not-so-nice shop head. (The flush rivets will be covered up by the attachment point to the fuselage, but the AN470's will not.)

Thank you, iamtheari! Really appreciate your input.
 
I'm at the OP's point of construction as well, and your answer answered my own identical question. But I have a follow-on question: The plans say that just 6 of the 10 holes are to be riveted with "flush aft" using AN426AD3-3.5 rivets. The other four holes along the top call for, according to the plans, to be riveted using AN470AD3-3.5 rivets.

I assume those 4 using standard round-head rivets will be riveted in the same direction as the 6 flush rivets, yes? Does it matter? Or is it just good form to rivet all in the same direction?

The plans try and specify if a specific installation direction of an AN470 rivet is required.
If it doesn't say, it is builders choice.
As a standard practice, it is good to orient the rivet so that the shop head is formed on the thicker material, if there is a difference.
 
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