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RV-14 or RV-10? What were your arguments?

mjanduda

Well Known Member
Hey builders,

I am a bit afraid there are already twenty threads about this, but I couldn't really find them.
I'm thinking about building an RV myself. I'd like to build an IFR capable plane. I do not like to build lots of carbon stuff (have had enough of carbon building at university). And I like XC and some acro. The idea to visit different continents with my own plane is appealing.
Now I'm not sure whether to go with a ten or a fourteen.

What where your thoughts when deciding pro RV-14?

Best,
Malte
 
14 insurance

If the 14 will do the job you only pay insurance on 2 seats not 4. If you don't need the 4 seats. I have had four seaters in the past and only filled the seats a handful of times.
 
If the 14 will do the job you only pay insurance on 2 seats not 4. If you don't need the 4 seats. I have had four seaters in the past and only filled the seats a handful of times.

True. I already thought about a three seater RV-10 with some extras instead of a fourth back seat. Long range tanks, more luggage space or an A/C.
Also the ten is a bit more stable and comfortable for XC?
BUT you cannot do loops...
 
$$$

How much $$ do you want to spend?
Use Vans calculator and add $20k for any upgrades.
This may help make your decision.;)
 
And the debate continues.

This is what I tell people when they ask me what RV I like best or what they should build:
- If you fly mostly solo and want aerobatics, build the RV-8.
- If you want to be a hero with the spouse and plan on a lot of cross country with her, build the RV-10.
- If you want a compromise between the two, build the RV-14.

Total cost of the RV-10 over the RV-14 is amazingly small. If you build the RV-14 do not get any engine other than the 210hp IO-390. It needs all those ponies.

If you want intercontinental range, the RV-10 best supports ferry tanks.

Carl
 
As always, define the mission first. Yours (as described) includes acro, so that's a hard limit right there and eliminates the -10. The -14 will do everything on your list.

I'm building a -14A as it suits my current mission profile exceptionally well. I loved my old -8, but my wife was never happy being relegated to the hapless/helpless position of backseat ballast; she'll be a much more comfortable and confident flyer upfront with me.

I can't remember the last time I needed more than two seats (I'd have to check my logbook, but it's certainly been more than ten years), so I had zero interest in the -10 before even considering its non-acro design. The -14A is the only RV which fits my needs.

Kit-wise, it's simply amazing how much progress has been made since I completed my -8 (from a standard kit) 16 years ago. The -14A is going together very quickly so far...
 
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There are a couple of ways of making decisions like this. It is important to differentiate between rational decisions and emotional decisions. Before anyone ?poo-poos? emotional decisions as valid, let?s just remind ourselves that there is really no rational reason ANY of us NEEDS an airplane...but we WANTED one badly enough to invest a lot of money and time in them!

Rational: look at how much it will cost to rent a 4 or more seater, then look at how much it will cost to rent an acro machine of your liking. Then decide which you will want more often and see what the cost differential is of renting the thing you want least frequently. If it?s cheaper to rent your least wanted thing...decision is done. If it is more expensive, then you need to continue the analysis.

Emotional: when someone asks about your plane how will you feel when you explain your choice? Which do you like the look of better? Ask yourself about the irrational aspects of the choice and don?t dismiss their importance.

If you still can?t decide then flip a coin, but instead of paying attention to the result, pay more attention to how you feel about the result. Disappointed by ?heads?? That will tell you what you actually WANT to build!

When you?re done with your choice, avoid second guessing...it will just sour you on the process. Commit and decide to love the build and when it gets frustrating (it will) commit to pushing through. It?s fun at the beginning, fun when major components are completed and fun when it?s done. There is a LONG middle! Try and make that fun too.
 
I would also recommend sitting in each A/C and see if you (and your spouse) are OK with spending a few hrs in it. I was surprised at how much of a negative feedback I got from my wife on the back seat of the 8. I agree with Carl. The 14 is a jack of all trades, master of none.... that’s what drove my decision to build a 14....
 
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I would also recommend sitting in each A/C and see if you (and your spouse) are OK with spending a few hrs in it. I was surprised at how much of a negative feedback I got from my wife on the back seat of the 8. I agree with Carl. The 14 is a jack of all trades, master of none.... that’s what drove my decision to build a 14....

Agreed completely. My wife was really surprised at how much she preferred the -14A's seating position vs. the -8's.

Re: "...master of none..." - Well, that's the nature of almost all engineered products: compromise. Nearly all aircraft have one or more significant design compromises baked in from the start; we have only to select the set that best fulfills our mission. Or, for some, feels right... :D
 
RV14 or Rv10

While you locate someone that has an aircraft to sit in check out this site- now and while you're building, there really isn't anyone out there that can give you more details than this guru himself.
Here is his site- http://www.myrv10.com/
specifically here is the page you want to look at- http://www.myrv14.com/commentary/RV10_or_RV14.html

I love the RV-10- for 4 people (if there aren't 4 now, maybe in a few years there will be) the RV-14 is 2 but either way you can never go wrong with a Vans aircraft.
Best of success in the decision process!
Pascal
 
I chose the RV-14 over the RV-7, RV-9, and RV-10. I own a Piper Arrow. It cruises at 130 KTAS on 9 GPH. It has four seats and can practically haul (including the pilot) 3 adults or one adult and 3 kids. I use MyFlightBook and log the number of passengers on each flight. I looked back to see how often that back seat was used. My dog can ride in the cargo area of the RV-14 so I didn't count her in this decision.

The answer is that I have only put people in the back seat of the Arrow four times in the 240 hours I have flown it, and all of those missions can be rearranged if they come up again. (Boy Scouts can go up one at a time instead of three at a time; I'm no longer married and don't need to travel with my wife and mother-in-law again; etc.) If I have a growing family in the future, I can buy a share in a six-seater for those flights and still not need the extra seating for most of my flying, which is mostly solo and maxes out at me, a hiking buddy, and my dog.

The RV-14 will get me significantly faster than the Arrow with a better autopilot, burning less fuel per mile and incurring lower maintenance costs. It will also be aerobatic-capable. I'm building a taildragger, so I will also have an easier time staying current and proficient at tailwheel flying and not need to do any catch-up flying before taking a passenger in the Cub, which is rare but much more common than having 2+ passengers in the Arrow.

For my mission, the RV-14 does everything I need and nothing I don't. I am also enjoying the build quite a bit. And that's the real key: Don't build if you don't enjoy building. You'll never finish.
 
I am also enjoying the build quite a bit. And that's the real key: Don't build if you don't enjoy building. You'll never finish.

Very true, indeed.

I realized the other day that, although I usually say that I build in order to own the finished product and not because I particularly like building, the truth is that I'm nearly always involved in a major build project of one sort or another (airplanes, kit cars, motorcycles, etc.). I must really enjoy it, denial notwithstanding! :D
 
My consideration between the 10 and the 14 as my next project was not seats for humans but for our dog. We have always had biggish Shepherds and a 14 would be great but won't fit both of us, a large dog and any reasonable luggage. Kinda like our cars it would be rare for a human to be in the back seat but it is frequently occupied.
 
My wife loved curling up in the back of the RV-10.

Four seats does not mean always having four people. Keep the boss happy.

Carl
6_C22_F9_AE-93_AF-4693-_B7_A6-_E00_E75_A1_FAC9.jpg
 
Ten years and more than 1000 hours in our 10, and I'd guess I only have someone in the back seat once or twice a year. The last time was my wife and I and another couple flew up to South Carolina to see the total eclipse. But, we have traveled extensively to all four corners of the lower 48. Once to Canada and several trips to the Bahamas. All of those trips were just my wife and I. Occasionally while on these trips I'll take friends or family for a ride while visiting and utilize the back seat. What has really spoiled us is the ability to bring along pretty much anything we want on long trips. (like a life raft on over water trips) We've been gone as long as a month on some trips. If we happen to pick up a few bottles of wine from Oregon or California we've always got plenty of room.
I flew aerobatics for several years in a Great Lakes and absolutely loved it. So, I was disappointed that the -10 was not aerobatic, but we knew that lots of cross country was really the mission we wanted.
I was talking to Tim Olson last year and commented that if I was building again, I'd probably build a -14 since we so rarely use the back seats and I'd like to be able to do some "gentlemans" aerobatics every now and then. He pointed out some of the same issues he eloquently talks about HERE
As most have noted, it really depends on your mission. Gotta have aerobatics? Obviously the -14 (or a 7 or an 8) will be your best option. Comfortable, flexible, and efficient cross country your thing? The -10 gets it. I now think I would build another -10 if I was going to build again. (assuming I can only have one airplane;))
 
One thing that I didn't think of until I was at Oshkosh this year is baggage compartment access. It was very easy to load my cooler and camping gear into and take it out of my Arrow because of the location of the baggage door (at floor level on the side of the airplane behind the wing). I think that it will be much more precarious to do this with the RV-14, where you have to lift things up into the plane and set them down into the baggage area. The RV-10 has a Cherokee-style baggage door, right? Advantage RV-10.
 
Ten years and more than 1000 hours in our 10, and I'd guess I only have someone in the back seat once or twice a year. The last time was my wife and I and another couple flew up to South Carolina to see the total eclipse. But, we have traveled extensively to all four corners of the lower 48. Once to Canada and several trips to the Bahamas. All of those trips were just my wife and I. Occasionally while on these trips I'll take friends or family for a ride while visiting and utilize the back seat. What has really spoiled us is the ability to bring along pretty much anything we want on long trips. (like a life raft on over water trips) We've been gone as long as a month on some trips. If we happen to pick up a few bottles of wine from Oregon or California we've always got plenty of room.
I flew aerobatics for several years in a Great Lakes and absolutely loved it. So, I was disappointed that the -10 was not aerobatic, but we knew that lots of cross country was really the mission we wanted.
I was talking to Tim Olson last year and commented that if I was building again, I'd probably build a -14 since we so rarely use the back seats and I'd like to be able to do some "gentlemans" aerobatics every now and then. He pointed out some of the same issues he eloquently talks about HERE
As most have noted, it really depends on your mission. Gotta have aerobatics? Obviously the -14 (or a 7 or an 8) will be your best option. Comfortable, flexible, and efficient cross country your thing? The -10 gets it. I now think I would build another -10 if I was going to build again. (assuming I can only have one airplane;))

Thank you David!
I really can identify with your story. But I feel a bit of disappointment in your conclusion to build an RV-10 assuming you can only have one airplane.
Probably my heart is with a 14. I'd love to travel around Europe with my RV. But also I'd love to do some really cool cloud surfing. When flying a second person on the Copilot seat is great. The value added by people in the back seats is quite small.
The 10 is cool because of it's payload. And I think it's smoother for IFR.

At the moment it's the 14. A small agile plane for light aerobatics, some IFR XC, two seats and some luggage.
How sensitive is the 14 to high payload? Is it possible to increase the MTOW?

Best,
Malte
 
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