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QB Wing Question

Hi Kevin,

how long did it take from order to delivery?

Malte

Malte,
Here is a timeline of the quickbuild order-delivery time frame for the U.S.

Ordered QB Fuse & Wings 12-18-2017
Van's Rec'd kits 06-25-2018
Paid final to Van's 06-27-2018
Delivered 09-02-2018

PM me about the delay in delivery. I used a preferred vendor that does not crate the kits and this created a substantial delay. I know this does not affect you in your location.
 
Tanks

I opted for the ER tanks. As such, I ended up removing mine from the QB wings. It wasn?t required but it made things easier. Especially leak checking the tanks. I found the B nuts on my vent lines were NOT tight. I made a stubby wrench to fish in through the fuel level sender hole to tighten them. It wasn?t difficult to remove the tanks...
 
Malte,
Here is a timeline of the quickbuild order-delivery time frame for the U.S.

Ordered QB Fuse & Wings 12-18-2017
Van's Rec'd kits 06-25-2018
Paid final to Van's 06-27-2018
Delivered 09-02-2018

PM me about the delay in delivery. I used a preferred vendor that does not crate the kits and this created a substantial delay. I know this does not affect you in your location.

Oshkosh got in the way no doubt. Preferred vendor is very busy July/Aug and extra time should be planned during this time. This vender handles the transfers of aircraft and pieces to/from Osh for Vans.
H
 
Thanks for the timeline!
I think even six months from ordering until the kit is at van's is quite a lot. Probably I'll go with slow build wings and a qb fuselage.

Malte
 

Turner - GREAT idea using the centre punch dots to mark your parts L/R and their alignment. I have tried many things - like marking with a sharpie (acid etch took it off), wires / tags (time consuming and acid took the pen off the tags anyway!), keeping track of them (way too easy to forget or mix it up), so I finally went ahead and purchased a little vibrating pencil - figuring I would just make a little mark somewhere on the part for L/R or alignment etc - but this idea is even simpler. Thank you!
 
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Turner - GREAT idea using the centre punch dots to mark your parts L/R and their alignment. I have tried many things - like marking with a sharpie (acid etch took it off), wires / tags (time consuming and acid took the pen off the tags anyway!), keeping track of them (way too easy to forget or mix it up), so I finally went ahead and purchased a little vibrating pencil - figuring I would just make a little mark somewhere on the part for L/R or alignment etc - but this idea is even simpler. Thank you!

Thanks for the feedback - this is a great community for sharing and I'm happy that I can contribute!
 
Turner - GREAT idea using the centre punch dots to mark your parts L/R and their alignment. I have tried many things - like marking with a sharpie (acid etch took it off), wires / tags (time consuming and acid took the pen off the tags anyway!), keeping track of them (way too easy to forget or mix it up), so I finally went ahead and purchased a little vibrating pencil - figuring I would just make a little mark somewhere on the part for L/R or alignment etc - but this idea is even simpler. Thank you!

Two things here caught my attention: "vibrating" and "pencil". I'm not entirely sure what this is, but it doesn't sound like it should be used on aluminum.

Is a vibrating pencil something that will scratch into the surface and does it actually use a lead pencil? Both of these are things that are detrimental to the longevity of aluminum aircraft structure.

The carbon in a lead pencil will work its way in between the grains of the aluminum and react with it to form intergranular corrosion. It's difficult if not impossible to remove lead pencil marks completely once you've applied them. If this pencil actually scratches the surface as it's laying down carbon that's even worse. Alodine or primer afterwards won't help as the carbon is already between the grains.

Also, I'm wary of marking the part with a center punch. This causes a stress riser at the punch site and it's more likely to start a crack over time. I'd stay away from doing this. Use the punch for marking the location of drilled holes as it's intended.

I assume you're priming or applying Alodine since you mention an acid etch. You can reapply a sharpie mark after you finish the priming or Alodine and avoid all of these issues.

I'm sensitive to these issues since my day job is aircraft stress/DaDT analysis and design of structural repairs.

Edit: After I wrote this I went to Turner's blog to see exactly where the punch marks were. It looks like you've got two marks close to the blind fastener. The fastener hole and the marks each have their own stress concentration factor (SCF). By being in close proximity to each other they multiply. However given this is a control pushrod that won't see much load (and therefore significant stress), you won't have an issue with potential cracks. This might be a good area to include on the annual condition inspection though.
 
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Two things here caught my attention: "vibrating" and "pencil". I'm not entirely sure what this is, but it doesn't sound like it should be used on aluminum.

Is a vibrating pencil something that will scratch into the surface and does it actually use a lead pencil? Both of these are things that are detrimental to the longevity of aluminum aircraft structure.

The carbon in a lead pencil will work its way in between the grains of the aluminum and react with it to form intergranular corrosion. It's difficult if not impossible to remove lead pencil marks completely once you've applied them. If this pencil actually scratches the surface as it's laying down carbon that's even worse. Alodine or primer afterwards won't help as the carbon is already between the grains.

Also, I'm wary of marking the part with a center punch. This causes a stress riser at the punch site and it's more likely to start a crack over time. I'd stay away from doing this. Use the punch for marking the location of drilled holes as it's intended.

I assume you're priming or applying Alodine since you mention an acid etch. You can reapply a sharpie mark after you finish the priming or Alodine and avoid all of these issues.

I'm sensitive to these issues since my day job is aircraft stress/DaDT analysis and design of structural repairs.

Edit: After I wrote this I went to Turner's blog to see exactly where the punch marks were. It looks like you've got two marks close to the blind fastener. The fastener hole and the marks each have their own stress concentration factor (SCF). By being in close proximity to each other they multiply. However given this is a control pushrod that won't see much load (and therefore significant stress), you won't have an issue with potential cracks. This might be a good area to include on the annual condition inspection though.

Good points Art - as you might expect control pushrods and associated rod ends and jam nuts will be high on the list for condition inspections. I've used the "dot" method rarely and I think judiciously. Never in what I would think to be high stress or highly loaded areas.

All that said, is there a bit too much focus on perfection and avoidance of any/all blemishes on our aircraft? I've owned and flown any number of 30-40 (or more) year old aircraft that have had their share of dings and less than perfect assembly without structural issues related to these - at the same time the structural failures/broken parts on those aircraft have typically occurred either from material defects or high-wear parts that reached a very reasonable service life. I guess my point is each of us as builders has to stop somewhere short of perfection in our building. Heaven knows I've obsessed excessively over any number of issues that my very level-headed EAA tech counselor has assured me were "just fine".
 
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Hi,

This is a ?vibrating pencil? for want of a better description. Not a pencil and not lead.
https://www.amazon.com/General-Tools-505-Cordless-Precision/dp/B004YK66NM

I?ve tried marking after etching (I?m using Stewart systems clean, etch then prime) - but the sharpie marks really don?t bleed through hardly at all. Haven?t had much success with the other methods listed below.

Is a couple of dots here and there really the doom and gloom you predict? I figured a little scratch with the vibrating pencil to mark orientation would not be that bad - I?ve made much worse by accident with the male dimple die! (Albeit scotchbrited them out before priming).

As an example, the doubler plates for the rudder spar had to go on with one face to the spar. Would one dot on each face make a difference?

Don?t get me wrong, I don?t know either way!! I just thought I had found a good solution in Turner?s idea...
 
Kevin, I too recently received my QB wings. I was having difficulty getting the fuel sender rod set just right and ended up calling Van?s for advice. They recommended removing the tanks , as doing so makes fitting the sender much easier. They also mentioned that it is nearly impossible to test the z-brackets for leaks with the tanks in the wings.

I elected to remove the tanks and the left one came off without any issues and setting the fuel sender was, indeed, much easier with the tank off of the wing. On the right side I found that two of the bolts through the spar into the z-brackets on the tank had been stripped. The were very difficult to reach and I finally had to drill them out. It wasn?t fun but doable with the wing in the wing stand. It would have been nearly impossible with the wing in the plane, I think. So, given that our wings are of the same vintage, you might want to make sure you can remove each of the fasteners even if you elect not to remove the tank itself.

Lyn
 
Hi,

This is a “vibrating pencil” for want of a better description. Not a pencil and not lead.
https://www.amazon.com/General-Tools-505-Cordless-Precision/dp/B004YK66NM

I’ve tried marking after etching (I’m using Stewart systems clean, etch then prime) - but the sharpie marks really don’t bleed through hardly at all. Haven’t had much success with the other methods listed below.

Is a couple of dots here and there really the doom and gloom you predict? I figured a little scratch with the vibrating pencil to mark orientation would not be that bad - I’ve made much worse by accident with the male dimple die! (Albeit scotchbrited them out before priming).

As an example, the doubler plates for the rudder spar had to go on with one face to the spar. Would one dot on each face make a difference?

Don’t get me wrong, I don’t know either way!! I just thought I had found a good solution in Turner’s idea...

Trent,

That's an excellent question! The short answer to the "doom and gloom" query is of course, it depends. The longer answer is, well, longer.

Just like a fire requires three components (heat, fuel, oxygen) to burn, a crack requires three components. First you need some kind of initial flaw. This could be a tool mark, an imperfection in the material, poorly formed grains, etc. Secondly, there must be repeated loading on the part. The final component is sufficient stress in the area of the flaw to cause it to grow on a microscopic level. If any of these things are missing a crack will not form.

A scratch not only serves as your initial flaw, but it also bumps up the far field stress at the flaw by the stress concentration factor.

I'm not suggesting that you can't have small blemishes here and there still be safe. I know I've got a few on my build, but nothing that gives me concern. Just like in real estate, it's all about location, location, location. In high load areas like spar flanges I'll make sure to remove any and all defects. For control rods like those mentioned in Turner's blog I don't have a problem with dots especially if they're not near fastener holes.

Regarding the marking issue, I was suggesting you mark the parts after the primer is cured. You just have to take steps to remember which part is L/R/front/rear while there's no identifier. I use little notes and lay the parts on opposite sides of the table to keep track of them. As soon as they're cured I mark them.

I looked at the link for the tool and it's labeled as an engraving tool. I would avoid using that and find another alternative. I remember before I started my build I read a great many builder's logs online and found one builder who stumbled on what he thought was a great idea. He started engraving the part number on all his parts with an engraving tool. I shuddered when I saw that.
 
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