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-   -   Support Problem for Jabiru Engines (http://www.vansairforce.com/community/showthread.php?t=914)

rv6ejguy 07-14-2005 11:24 AM

Jabiru is on its 4th or 5th head cylinder revision now with many people reporting leaks at this junction as well as overheating problems, cracks and poor service from Jabiru at least in Canada.

Check this out too: http://www.masquito.be/progress3.htm

A friend of mine constructing a KR2 considered a Jabiru until he researched it more. Too many unresolved issues he said despite this engine being certified in OZ. I think if you do more digging, there are some more unflattering things out there. I'd check it out carefully and wouldn't be the first to try the flat 8.

Rotary10-RV 07-14-2005 11:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rv6ejguy
Jabiru is on its 4th or 5th head cylinder revision now with many people reporting leaks at this junction as well as overheating problems, cracks and poor service from Jabiru at least in Canada.

Check this out too: http://www.masquito.be/progress3.htm

A friend of mine constructing a KR2 considered a Jabiru until he researched it more. Too many unresolved issues he said despite this engine being certified in OZ. I think if you do more digging, there are some more unflattering things out there. I'd check it out carefully and wouldn't be the first to try the flat 8.

If you research the rotax engines you will find that they had a bunch of problems with the 912 and 914 engines after their initial release. Siezed valve rockers ere the most notable recurrent problem. Most new engines have some teething problems. To bad the Jabaru guys seem to be dropping the ball on this problem. On the use of washers on the relief spring. The high pressure relief only functions (hopefully) when the engine is cold. It is not an oil pressure regulator control. I will confirm that if you have too low an oil pressure when hot there are probably clearance problems. One thing to check is the pump itself. check for damage an excessive side clearance. Don't know if Jabaru uses a gear or gerrotor pump but gear pumps can be strongly effected by just a little extra side clearance.
Bill Jepson
Rotary10-RV

rv6ejguy 07-14-2005 12:04 PM

Certainly new engines have their developmental problems but it does not seem that Jabiru is stepping up to the plate with proper service and these problems have existed for years now. I suspect that if they had to pay to replace all the problem assemblies, they wouldn't survive. Aerocat tried some 3300s in their design and also decided that they were not ready for prime time: http://www.creativeflight.com/engines.html

Rotary10-RV 07-14-2005 12:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rv6ejguy
Certainly new engines have their developmental problems but it does not seem that Jabiru is stepping up to the plate with proper service and these problems have existed for years now. I suspect that if they had to pay to replace all the problem assemblies, they wouldn't survive. Aerocat tried some 3300s in their design and also decided that they were not ready for prime time: http://www.creativeflight.com/engines.html

No arguement here, wish it were otherwise.
Bill

kkinney 12-29-2005 11:28 AM

New to this thread
 
I've recently ran across this thread.

While I don't want to disparage any person or post, I do see a lot of "friend of a friend" quotes. There are little or no posts from the actual person receiving the problem.
In posts with links to web sites, I see two entries that state up front there were considerable modifications. How many manufacturers support every possible permutation of aftermarket equipment? Certainly not Lyco or Continental.

I don't mean to say Jabiru doesn't have a problem, but from the posts thus far, I can't see any hard evidence of that.

Now as to the pressure problem - Last August I attended a Jabiru seminar, conducted by Pete Krotje in Tennessee. It was lead by Don Richter, the Australian developer of the Jabiru engines, who stayed over an extra week or two after Osh.
We learned that oil pressure problems could be caused by -
1. Low oil content
2. Overheated oil / no cooler
3. Ineffective cooler action
4. Gauge / sender / wiring
5. Oil leakage around relief valve
6. Bearing condition / damage
7. Oil pump condition
8. Oil suction leak
9. Incorrect oil
10. Oil too hot

All these were outlined in a Jaba Chat newsletter you can find at - http://www.jabiru.net.au/news/jabach...ugust_2005.pdf
I would recommend printing all the Jaba Chats, if you are curious about a jab engine.


If you have specific questions, there are a news forums available for use -
http://www.jabiru.net.au/discussions/default.asp
(Since Jab hosts this, I would expect responses to be both quick & accurate. Personally, I use the next link, since Pete & Andy, US distributors, monitor it.)
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/jabiruengines/

If there is any doubt as to what bulletins are available, they can be found at - http://www.jabiru.net.au/news/techni...ngineBulletins

It's just my opinion, but to get an official call on any Jab rumor you've heard, I'd post to one of these forums. VansAirForce.com is a great learning tool, but I would guess a Jabiru forum would provide a better place for you questions.

Just my .02 woth, (actual value may be far less than .02)
Kevin Kinney

rv6ejguy 12-29-2005 03:29 PM

I think the RV9 and the newer lightweight Van's design are possible candidates for some of the Jabiru models. The links I earlier posted here are hardly second hand accounts of problems encountered with response and rectification by Jabiru. Additionally, my friend with the KR2S told me directly about his poor service from Jabiru and what his research had turned up from early users. These included direct phone conversations.

I've said it before in the aviation field: If you don't respond to customer E-mails, if you don't admit there is a problem when actually there is, it will come back to haunt you and you lose credibility. Clearly this has happened in the past. Has Jabiru fixed these problems now and do they respond in a tmely fashion to querries? I don't know the answers to those questions.

I welcome the links posted here to the Jabiru forums so we can see what the current status of problems and service is like from Jabiru today from the customer perspective.

My .02 worth. Get back to clients within 24 hours, tell them the truth, fix the problem, ship them the parts when you promise and don't let the customer pay the bill if it's your fault. Works wonders in my business.

Ever wonder why you don't read about problems like this with Van's, David Clark, Garmin etc?

I truly hope that Jabiru has turned this around and people are happy with their current products and service. I like the basic layout and the CNC'd billet, aircooled flat concept and wish them well.

garnt.piper 12-29-2005 10:47 PM

Jabiru 5100
 
Two weeks ago I flew my 180/fp RV-4 to Queensland and while there visited the Jabiru engine factory and spoke with the owner, Ian Bent. I flew the RV-6 with the 5100 fitted with him, and was impressed. It was hot and we only flew at low level around the local area, but performance to me was what I expected from 180hp. It was smooth and pulled well, very similar to my -4 but with a compeletely different vibe. The temps and pressures were normal given the hot, humid conditions. The engine impressed with its smoothness and ease of operation. I'd certainly consider one in an RV if I were to build another. I raised the topic of engine problems and alleged factory support shortcomings, and Ian's reply was that all the investigations that they have done found installation errors or other failures to follow Jabiru recommendations. All engines are dyno tested prior to shipment, so any chronic problems should be detected at that stage, such as low oil pressure. He acknowledged that development is continuing, and that product improvements will continue to be made.

I too think that all rumours should be investigated to the source and not rely soley on hearsay. Jabiru have been around a while now and intend staying in the market, and have proved they are not the fly-by-night charlatans that are too common in Experimental Aviation. They have brought a product to market at an affordable price, which is what we need, not endless promise and glossy brochures at Oshkosh each year, as the start-up capital gets used and then they disappear.

Give them a fair go, I seem to remember Lycoming shipping faulty crankshafts, and attempting to influence crash investigation reports to their advantage.


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