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rv6ejguy 03-16-2018 06:15 AM

Keep up the good work Charlie and if you'd like some help in matching a turbo, I'd be happy to help.

Let's try to keep this thread on topic and positive please.

charosenz 03-16-2018 10:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rv6ejguy (Post 1246175)
Keep up the good work Charlie and if you'd like some help in matching a turbo, I'd be happy to help.

Let's try to keep this thread on topic and positive please.

P

Ross

Thanks.

I want to be concervative and keep pressure and heat reasonably low.

With the unique issue of the Pressure Ratio being higher at altitude I am leaning on a slightly higher capacity compressor than what I would use for a car on the ground.

Based on my early calculations I am looking at a max flow of about 18 lbs/min and P.R. at altitude of 2.0 (40"/20"). Hence the engine will only "see" 5lbs of boost.

That being said, I like the looks of a 28 turbine and a 60 compressor with an A/R on the turbine side somewhere .62 or higher.

Thoughts?

Canadian_JOY 03-16-2018 12:23 PM

Just a brief comment about adjusting your Warp Drive prop. The manufacturer's instructions are pretty good when it comes to telling you how to adjust it, but they could be better. I discovered this when setting the 3-blade Warp prop on my "other" airplane. These discoveries ultimately yielded much smoother operation.

Tip 1) When adjusting prop pitch, do it for all 3 blades at exactly the same rotational angle. Achieve this goal by pulling your spark plugs so you can easily turn the engine. Rotate the prop so the leading edge of Blade 1 is horizontal as measured with a 24" carpenter's level or similar (I used a digital level). Now adjust your blade pitch as necessary. Repeat for Blade 2 and Blade 3. In our case I make the adjustments with the prop blade at the 3 o'clock position, as viewed from the cockpit. Each blade is adjusted only after it has been rotated to the 3 o'clock position.

Tip 2) If using Warp's prop protractor, you will notice the bubble is narrower than the space between the two lines printed on the spirit level vial. This is a source of inaccuracy. Always set your pitch with one end of the bubble directly beneath one of the lubber lines. Doesn't matter which one - pick one and stick with it. This will remove the tiny bit of guesswork that goes on when we are trying to center the bubble between the two lines. Peg the bubble up against a line and there's no guesswork.

By following these two tips the net effect on prop blade pitch will be small, but on our aircraft it made a noticeable improvement in "buzz" coming back into the cockpit. The Warp prop protractor is a great tool. Using these two tips makes it work even better.

rv6ejguy 03-16-2018 12:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by charosenz (Post 1246234)
P

Ross

Thanks.

I want to be concervative and keep pressure and heat reasonably low.

With the unique issue of the Pressure Ratio being higher at altitude I am leaning on a slightly higher capacity compressor than what I would use for a car on the ground.

Based on my early calculations I am looking at a max flow of about 18 lbs/min and P.R. at altitude of 2.0 (40"/20"). Hence the engine will only "see" 5lbs of boost.

That being said, I like the looks of a 28 turbine and a 60 compressor with an A/R on the turbine side somewhere .62 or higher.

Thoughts?

What altitude and hp are trying to match for? I'll run some calcs and see what I come up with. Typically we run very loose turbine housings and very large turbines for aircraft applications. Wanna run ball or journal bearings?

charosenz 03-16-2018 07:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Canadian_JOY (Post 1246254)
Just a brief comment about adjusting your Warp Drive prop. The manufacturer's instructions are pretty good when it comes to telling you how to adjust it, but they could be better. I discovered this when setting the 3-blade Warp prop on my "other" airplane. These discoveries ultimately yielded much smoother operation.

Tip 1) When adjusting prop pitch, do it for all 3 blades at exactly the same rotational angle. Achieve this goal by pulling your spark plugs so you can easily turn the engine. Rotate the prop so the leading edge of Blade 1 is horizontal as measured with a 24" carpenter's level or similar (I used a digital level). Now adjust your blade pitch as necessary. Repeat for Blade 2 and Blade 3. In our case I make the adjustments with the prop blade at the 3 o'clock position, as viewed from the cockpit. Each blade is adjusted only after it has been rotated to the 3 o'clock position.

Tip 2) If using Warp's prop protractor, you will notice the bubble is narrower than the space between the two lines printed on the spirit level vial. This is a source of inaccuracy. Always set your pitch with one end of the bubble directly beneath one of the lubber lines. Doesn't matter which one - pick one and stick with it. This will remove the tiny bit of guesswork that goes on when we are trying to center the bubble between the two lines. Peg the bubble up against a line and there's no guesswork.

By following these two tips the net effect on prop blade pitch will be small, but on our aircraft it made a noticeable improvement in "buzz" coming back into the cockpit. The Warp prop protractor is a great tool. Using these two tips makes it work even better.

You pretty much described what I do as well. I also use a digital pitch angle gauge that goes down to a tenth of a degree. Works great.

charosenz 03-16-2018 07:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rv6ejguy (Post 1246261)
What altitude and hp are trying to match for? I'll run some calcs and see what I come up with. Typically we run very loose turbine housings and very large turbines for aircraft applications. Wanna run ball or journal bearings?

I am targeting 5 lbs at 10,000 feet, which is what I meant when describing the 2.0 pressure ration where by I would be using roughly 40" MAP, with roughly a 20" pressure outside air.

Since I am not needing a quick spool and relatively low boost at 5lbs over "normal" 1 bar, I am absolutly fine with a journal bearing. It will be a oil and water CHRA.

Let me know what numbers you come up with. My calcs come up with 18lbs/min with less than 1.5 P.R. at sea level and 2.0 at 10k feet.

Charlie.

rv6ejguy 03-17-2018 02:17 PM

My calcs show around 32 lbs./min. for 175hp at 10,000 feet and 40 inches.

I'd use pretty much the same compressor size as on my RV and probably around a .62 a/r turbine housing.

charosenz 03-17-2018 05:54 PM

exhaust down pipe and internal exhaust "manifold"
 
Here is a link to a picture of my exhaust. Notice the internal (integral) exhaust manifold - with only a single exhaust outlet. Great. I welded up a stainless steel exhaust adapter to the honda bolt pattern with a T-25 turbo flange bolt pattern on the exit flange.

I do not have the turbo on it yet. I am still debating on the one to use.

Notice the dual O2 weld bungs. I am using a wide band meter which is very accurate and the nice part is that it also has an aux output that the SDS EFI comuter takes so I can see my A/R in both the WB meter and the SDS display.

I also have a EGT temp probe in the back of the down pipe out of view which is why you see the band clamp just above the O2 sensor.

Also notice the oil temp sender with capped AN fitting ready to supply turbo oil and the blue AN fitting on the pan for the turbo oil return.

https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/oX...E=w359-h637-no

Hope this photo comes out. First time posting a google photo link to this forum....

Charlie

charosenz 03-17-2018 06:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rv6ejguy (Post 1246515)
My calcs show around 32 lbs./min. for 175hp at 10,000 feet and 40 inches.

I'd use pretty much the same compressor size as on my RV and probably around a .62 a/r turbine housing.


Ross, what set up are you using? What trim on the compressor and A/R and Trim on the turbine side? What MAP do you use at 10k?

Here are the numbers I am ran lately. The are calculated with 10lb boost, even thought I only plan to use 5-7lbs - at sea level. But I ran it with 10 lbs to get me the performance of the turbo at 10k altitude where it will be 40" (10lbs) over 20"....

http://cybrina.mooo.com:8080/WebModu...&Submit=Submit

This suggests 18lbs/min. I ran a completely different calculator and got the same results.....

Charlie

charosenz 03-17-2018 11:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by charosenz (Post 1246553)
Ross, what set up are you using? What trim on the compressor and A/R and Trim on the turbine side? What MAP do you use at 10k?

Here are the numbers I am ran lately. The are calculated with 10lb boost, even thought I only plan to use 5-7lbs - at sea level. But I ran it with 10 lbs to get me the performance of the turbo at 10k altitude where it will be 40" (10lbs) over 20"....

http://cybrina.mooo.com:8080/WebModu...&Submit=Submit

This suggests 18lbs/min. I ran a completely different calculator and got the same results.....

Charlie

Ross, d
* UPDATE *

I found a different calculator on line (Matchbot) by Borgwarner, and this time ran the numbers that included a variable for altitude, and I see the reference to 30+ lbs/min that you mentioned.

Here is a link to what I came up with .

http://www.turbos.bwauto.com/afterma...6_wrsin=92044&

I also noted that there were two different numbers as it relates to lbs/min. It shows about 30+ lbs/min on the comperssor side, but only about 19 lbs / min on the turbine side.

would you agree with this? and what you see on the link?

I am still interested in the details of your real life experience with the turbo set up on your RV6a - especially considering you have almost 500 hours on it...I know other readers would like to know as well...

Charlie.


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