bigginsking
Member
14 weeks after putting the money down my EFIS has shipped. From what I've read in this space before that seems like a short wait although I was told 8-10 weeks.
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BMA EFIS Lite
- Thread starter bigginsking
- Start date
bigginsking
Member
Oh, it has shipped. That was the point of my post. Give everyone an accurate measure of the lead time. I ordered in May 2 and it shipped Aug. 8.
Martorious
Member
Do you have it yet? Update please!
glenmthompson
Well Known Member
Good laughs calling BM!!!
Yep, ya want a good laugh? Call BM and ask the following:
:I heard a guy was quoted 8 weeks (for efis lite) and finally gave up after 4 months, wow is that true?
:I heard a guy purchased an EFIS 1 and spent over $19,000 (50% down on day 1) on the above guy's recommendation, was quoted delivery in 14 days, FINALLY received after almost 3 months (mucho whining), and, the above individual, an experienced builder, engineer, NOT an avionics novice, spent over 75 hours installing said EFIS 1 and was amazed at the omissions, lack of jumpers, bad analog 3 card, sensors, wireing errors in BM harnesses, falsehoods, misrepresentations, and just wrong stuff in the manual. Is this true? (Call Bob, the tech guy to confirm all the above)
:I heard that all BM products are "fluid" in their movement, as in almost instantaneous reaction to attitude changes like Dynon, GRT, Chelton. Is that true?
:I heard the installation manual for the EFIS 1 ($19,000++ with autopilot) is very complete and virtually plug and play with BM wireing harnesses, is that true? ( I am laughing hysterically writing this myself!)
Just a few of the questions off the top of my head I that I am VERY familiar with,... PM me for details...Have fun, and see you at the GRT counter at Sun N Fun next year. That is where myself and NUMEROUS friends are now taking our EFIS dollars.
Glen
Yep, ya want a good laugh? Call BM and ask the following:
:I heard a guy was quoted 8 weeks (for efis lite) and finally gave up after 4 months, wow is that true?
:I heard a guy purchased an EFIS 1 and spent over $19,000 (50% down on day 1) on the above guy's recommendation, was quoted delivery in 14 days, FINALLY received after almost 3 months (mucho whining), and, the above individual, an experienced builder, engineer, NOT an avionics novice, spent over 75 hours installing said EFIS 1 and was amazed at the omissions, lack of jumpers, bad analog 3 card, sensors, wireing errors in BM harnesses, falsehoods, misrepresentations, and just wrong stuff in the manual. Is this true? (Call Bob, the tech guy to confirm all the above)
:I heard that all BM products are "fluid" in their movement, as in almost instantaneous reaction to attitude changes like Dynon, GRT, Chelton. Is that true?
:I heard the installation manual for the EFIS 1 ($19,000++ with autopilot) is very complete and virtually plug and play with BM wireing harnesses, is that true? ( I am laughing hysterically writing this myself!)
Just a few of the questions off the top of my head I that I am VERY familiar with,... PM me for details...Have fun, and see you at the GRT counter at Sun N Fun next year. That is where myself and NUMEROUS friends are now taking our EFIS dollars.
Glen
glenmthompson
Well Known Member
PS to my previous post.
One more thing then I promise to get off my soap box yet once again. When you call Sheilla for a few good laughs at BM, I have one more question for you to ask her.
Ask her if she heard of the guy (myself), that sold all of his flight instruments on the promise to his face at Sun N Fun, the the unit would be delivered the following week. The ensueing grounding of my aircraft was the final, massive straw that put me bitterly over the edge when I found out that numerous other individuals received their units before me even though I had my deposite in MONTHS BEFORE them!
Last note, GRT WILL NOT take your money until delivery, unlike BM.
Glen
One more thing then I promise to get off my soap box yet once again. When you call Sheilla for a few good laughs at BM, I have one more question for you to ask her.
Ask her if she heard of the guy (myself), that sold all of his flight instruments on the promise to his face at Sun N Fun, the the unit would be delivered the following week. The ensueing grounding of my aircraft was the final, massive straw that put me bitterly over the edge when I found out that numerous other individuals received their units before me even though I had my deposite in MONTHS BEFORE them!
Last note, GRT WILL NOT take your money until delivery, unlike BM.
Glen
glenmthompson
Well Known Member
Certainly, displays are not fluid!!!
I have even held the factory EFIS 1 CPU box in my hand at Sun N Fun, with Greg (I think) watching, and he even admits that when all pages are displayd, the update times slow down!. Now, for anyone who doubts my statement that the displays"step", hold a unit in your hand and watch the horizon line as you move the unit say....5-10 degrees per second ( not a horrible pitch or roll rate, especially in turbulance). Watch carefully, you will not beleive you are looking at a 16,000 dollar display! Now, grab your friend's Dynon, or GRT and do the same. There is NO COMPARISON on the fluidity of the movement!
As far as support, once you get past their accusations that I, builder friend and his computer Geek son am clueless, ( still VERY upset at this)... The factory is great at crisis management.
Glen
I have even held the factory EFIS 1 CPU box in my hand at Sun N Fun, with Greg (I think) watching, and he even admits that when all pages are displayd, the update times slow down!. Now, for anyone who doubts my statement that the displays"step", hold a unit in your hand and watch the horizon line as you move the unit say....5-10 degrees per second ( not a horrible pitch or roll rate, especially in turbulance). Watch carefully, you will not beleive you are looking at a 16,000 dollar display! Now, grab your friend's Dynon, or GRT and do the same. There is NO COMPARISON on the fluidity of the movement!
As far as support, once you get past their accusations that I, builder friend and his computer Geek son am clueless, ( still VERY upset at this)... The factory is great at crisis management.
Glen
glenmthompson
Well Known Member
Efis comparison...
Yep, side by side comparisons of the units is pretty much mandatory, especially with the lower prices of all the lites coming online from GRT and Dynon.
Glen
Yep, side by side comparisons of the units is pretty much mandatory, especially with the lower prices of all the lites coming online from GRT and Dynon.
Glen
BMA EFIS Performance
Glen, I can see that you've had issues with BMA regarding the delivery of your G3 Lite. However your comparison of EFIS One performance vs that of the G3 Lite is apples vs oranges. A fully configured EFIS One with all of the 3D terrain running does indeed have a slower refresh rate than it does in "Standard" or "Acro" mode. They tell you up front not to use terrain mode when doing any "yanking and banking". That being said the current performance is appx 105 degrees per second for the EFIS One. NOW, let's talk about the G3 Lite, which is a totally new technology instrument, that has a roll rate of appx 400 deg per second! And, right you are, side by side comparison, while very difficult to arrange, even at a trade show (think about the logistics of making that happen) would probably be the end of the competition in performance comparison.
With regards to support, the company owner has proven over and over again that he will do WHATEVER it takes to make his customers happy. Don't believe me, check their discussion board and see for yourself.
In closing, sharing your displeasure with a company is not only your right, but the American way, but there's no reason to try to sway fellow RV builders with innacurrate information.
Glen, I can see that you've had issues with BMA regarding the delivery of your G3 Lite. However your comparison of EFIS One performance vs that of the G3 Lite is apples vs oranges. A fully configured EFIS One with all of the 3D terrain running does indeed have a slower refresh rate than it does in "Standard" or "Acro" mode. They tell you up front not to use terrain mode when doing any "yanking and banking". That being said the current performance is appx 105 degrees per second for the EFIS One. NOW, let's talk about the G3 Lite, which is a totally new technology instrument, that has a roll rate of appx 400 deg per second! And, right you are, side by side comparison, while very difficult to arrange, even at a trade show (think about the logistics of making that happen) would probably be the end of the competition in performance comparison.
With regards to support, the company owner has proven over and over again that he will do WHATEVER it takes to make his customers happy. Don't believe me, check their discussion board and see for yourself.
In closing, sharing your displeasure with a company is not only your right, but the American way, but there's no reason to try to sway fellow RV builders with innacurrate information.
I agree with N714b. I ordered two EFIS G3s from BMA and they took 6 or 7 months to get to me. So, I was upset and called them multiple times about it. I wasn't happy with how Sheila seemed to give you what ever answer you wanted and then didn't deliver. (Literally and figuratively.) However, I did finally get all of my equipment and although I haven't actually flown yet, I still think that the BMA is probably the best bang for the buck. (At least for me.) It looks good, has a GPS map, has autopilot capability plus all the other bells and whistles you expect from an EFIS. Also, they are always working on new and improved updates that I can download. (I don't think DYNON and others offer this capability.) Plus, they have provided good personal technical support on the questions I did have.
BMA has one of the best discussion boards I have seen and that goes a long way in my book. Also, an awful lot of people have their products installed and really seem to like them, so they all can't be wrong.
BMA has one of the best discussion boards I have seen and that goes a long way in my book. Also, an awful lot of people have their products installed and really seem to like them, so they all can't be wrong.
glenmthompson
Well Known Member
Yep...
Yep, N714B, they canot be all wrong, if they are lucky enough to actually RECEIVE their instruments! And....not sell their entire panel and have to ground their plane due to empty promises (read lies). Yep, they are lucky people....Now, about the alleged "misinformation".
A side by side comparison is most definately NOT necissary! When you roll "by hand" ANY of the BM units, (I have done so to them all, and personally installed an EFIS 1, I might add), yes, they may be in excess of 100 deg/sec, BUT, in that one second, there are just not enough "refreshes" or "updates" to be fluid! Compared to their competitors, the movement is not fluid by any sighted man's opinion! Also, the attitude and heading displays are far from rock solid, they jitter around. Misinformation?, nope, sorry, nuh uh.
Oh, and both Dynon and GRT are in excess of 200 deg/sec AND the GRT is autopilot friendly.
Here is the BM discussion board/thread on our Efis 1 install. http://www.bluemountainavionics.com/talk/showthread.php?t=784
Here is the site for GRT new sport lite(http://www.grtavionics.com/sport.htm), and oh yea, it is cheaper than BM, and they will not take any money until unit is shipped. Great concept, huh?
Oh yea, did I mention too that the GRT unit is much larger than the lite at 6.25x4.75 inches?
I very well might be "swaying" people's opinion on BM products, but I feel I was burned by them, and am quite NOT alone in finding quite a few things in other units that are better than BM. BM is not a perfect, all inclusive product, in either their low or high end units.
I certainly appreciate the following that greg has...And ya know what? I was one too, and the 1 I installed for my friend, purchased his unit on my recommendations.
One more parting note while I am throwing darts...I never was once told "my wireing is F----- up" by the other Greg at GRT when I had a small problem with my EIS from GRT. I am sad to say BM did not have the same respect for our project.
Questions? 561-670-6095
Glen
Yep, N714B, they canot be all wrong, if they are lucky enough to actually RECEIVE their instruments! And....not sell their entire panel and have to ground their plane due to empty promises (read lies). Yep, they are lucky people....Now, about the alleged "misinformation".
A side by side comparison is most definately NOT necissary! When you roll "by hand" ANY of the BM units, (I have done so to them all, and personally installed an EFIS 1, I might add), yes, they may be in excess of 100 deg/sec, BUT, in that one second, there are just not enough "refreshes" or "updates" to be fluid! Compared to their competitors, the movement is not fluid by any sighted man's opinion! Also, the attitude and heading displays are far from rock solid, they jitter around. Misinformation?, nope, sorry, nuh uh.
Oh, and both Dynon and GRT are in excess of 200 deg/sec AND the GRT is autopilot friendly.
Here is the BM discussion board/thread on our Efis 1 install. http://www.bluemountainavionics.com/talk/showthread.php?t=784
Here is the site for GRT new sport lite(http://www.grtavionics.com/sport.htm), and oh yea, it is cheaper than BM, and they will not take any money until unit is shipped. Great concept, huh?
Oh yea, did I mention too that the GRT unit is much larger than the lite at 6.25x4.75 inches?
I very well might be "swaying" people's opinion on BM products, but I feel I was burned by them, and am quite NOT alone in finding quite a few things in other units that are better than BM. BM is not a perfect, all inclusive product, in either their low or high end units.
I certainly appreciate the following that greg has...And ya know what? I was one too, and the 1 I installed for my friend, purchased his unit on my recommendations.
One more parting note while I am throwing darts...I never was once told "my wireing is F----- up" by the other Greg at GRT when I had a small problem with my EIS from GRT. I am sad to say BM did not have the same respect for our project.
Questions? 561-670-6095
Glen
N395V
Well Known Member
Blue Mountain
Very clearly you should get rid of your Blue mountain and buy something you will like.
Spend a lot of time talking to and intertacting with your new supplier so you are certain they won't be condescending or insulting to you. It sounds like if you have another experience like this you are gonna have a stroke.
For me I'll continue to fly my EFIS One and EFIS Lite. They work great and these tired old eyes don't notice anything skittish or a lag.
Best of luck with your next system.
Very clearly you should get rid of your Blue mountain and buy something you will like.
Spend a lot of time talking to and intertacting with your new supplier so you are certain they won't be condescending or insulting to you. It sounds like if you have another experience like this you are gonna have a stroke.
For me I'll continue to fly my EFIS One and EFIS Lite. They work great and these tired old eyes don't notice anything skittish or a lag.
Best of luck with your next system.
glenmthompson
Well Known Member
Stroke? Hmm, maybe BM would like me to have one!
Well sir, if another company treats me and others like BM does to some, well, not a stroke, but similar retribution.
Ya know something funny? Why is it, that I am unable to find anything other than sunlight reading issues with Dynon for example, that others complain about? Others may not have some bells and whistles,, ie. winds aloft.... But..... well ......I am tired of repeating myself, and apparently others are tired of hearing.
If there is anybody foolish enough to risk their deposit moneyand wait forever, and wants to talk, I will, unlike many BM lovers, once again give my phone number.
561-670-6095.
PS, EVERY person that views the EFIS 1 I installed for my friend not myself, pay attention, (yet to fly), asks why the display jitters. Dozens of people are able to see this. Hmmmmm And the displays at Sun N Fun did the same. Many are awed by all the info and are not standing back to see annoying details.
Glen
Well sir, if another company treats me and others like BM does to some, well, not a stroke, but similar retribution.
Ya know something funny? Why is it, that I am unable to find anything other than sunlight reading issues with Dynon for example, that others complain about? Others may not have some bells and whistles,, ie. winds aloft.... But..... well ......I am tired of repeating myself, and apparently others are tired of hearing.
If there is anybody foolish enough to risk their deposit moneyand wait forever, and wants to talk, I will, unlike many BM lovers, once again give my phone number.
561-670-6095.
PS, EVERY person that views the EFIS 1 I installed for my friend not myself, pay attention, (yet to fly), asks why the display jitters. Dozens of people are able to see this. Hmmmmm And the displays at Sun N Fun did the same. Many are awed by all the info and are not standing back to see annoying details.
Glen
henriquerv9
Active Member
BM x DYNON
Hey guys,
I was intended to buy a BM lite ,but it seems not to be a good idea.. I would like to have a GPS and autopilot output together in the efis . But i ve seem many complains about the BM comercial dept (delivery issues) So i am seriously thinking in buy the dynon D-10A, wich is in stock. It does not has the GPS and autopilot output,but I already have a Garmin 296 installed in my panel.... Is there any other good EFIS options for a reasonable price?
regards
Henrique Castro
[email protected]
RV9A PP-XRV
Hey guys,
I was intended to buy a BM lite ,but it seems not to be a good idea.. I would like to have a GPS and autopilot output together in the efis . But i ve seem many complains about the BM comercial dept (delivery issues) So i am seriously thinking in buy the dynon D-10A, wich is in stock. It does not has the GPS and autopilot output,but I already have a Garmin 296 installed in my panel.... Is there any other good EFIS options for a reasonable price?
regards
Henrique Castro
[email protected]
RV9A PP-XRV
henriquerv9 said:
'reasonable' needs to be defined but the GRT (www.grtavionics.com) units are very nice from what I have seen. The sport has (will have) EFIS and support for GPS input for under 3K. This unit ships this fall. The users seem to be mostly happy with things like features, stability and delivery. Some seem to not be satisfied with the documentation.
http://www.grtavionics.com/sport.htm
For 6K you can get their system with full up engine monitoring:
http://www.grtavionics.com/efis_horizond_series_1.htm
For lots more you can get 2 & 3 screen versions.
For information from people who have bought and flown GRT see this group on yahoo:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/GRT_EFIS/
Chuck
glenmthompson
Well Known Member
Efis 1 install update...
The previous discussed Efis 1 I am installing for my friend, we have the following problems that are rampant amog other units, and has no solution IAW BM:
:Heading jitters +/- 2 degrees, especially while taxiing, even sitting still... only high speed taxi tests have been performed so far.
:Tach has proven to be erratic. Calibration so far proves to show the following...Inconsistant AD readings, resulting in +/- 125 RPM readings, others say is rock stesdy, I say ours is basically unuasble...AD readings change daily for a given RPM...Does not read below 700 RPM, and below 1000 RPM, reads +/- 250 RPM. Still cannot get a consistant reading even close to the max RPM of 2700. Have hand held digital to confirm all the above.
:Map moves dead nuts on, this will be awsome, but ADI/T&B still shows no signs of fluidity..
ower draw appears to be over taxing our small standby battery, on the daylight readable brightness.
:Overall an incredibly impressive display, still with the previously mentioned annoying problems.
Glen has a recommendation for all who care to hear....Install dual GRT's., package for 12,500, including engine monitoring, add a grand for sensors and FF. Install a Garmin 396 for ...GPS signal, XM stereo, metars, TAF, nexrad, car option, etc for another 3000 installed, add autopilot for another 3 grand, and guess what??? You have everything the EFIS 1 one has except winds aloft (396 can compute them for you). Plus, you have national up to the minute national WX radar, AND, you have your standby airdata and attitude reference that would cost you more with the EFIS 1 I might add!
A FULL, SAFE, approved IFR glass panel with stby systems and autopilot for what the 1 costs!
Just one very outspoken, experienced consumer's idea on how to spend your 20K in your panel.
Glen
The previous discussed Efis 1 I am installing for my friend, we have the following problems that are rampant amog other units, and has no solution IAW BM:
:Heading jitters +/- 2 degrees, especially while taxiing, even sitting still... only high speed taxi tests have been performed so far.
:Tach has proven to be erratic. Calibration so far proves to show the following...Inconsistant AD readings, resulting in +/- 125 RPM readings, others say is rock stesdy, I say ours is basically unuasble...AD readings change daily for a given RPM...Does not read below 700 RPM, and below 1000 RPM, reads +/- 250 RPM. Still cannot get a consistant reading even close to the max RPM of 2700. Have hand held digital to confirm all the above.
:Map moves dead nuts on, this will be awsome, but ADI/T&B still shows no signs of fluidity..
ower draw appears to be over taxing our small standby battery, on the daylight readable brightness.:Overall an incredibly impressive display, still with the previously mentioned annoying problems.
Glen has a recommendation for all who care to hear....Install dual GRT's., package for 12,500, including engine monitoring, add a grand for sensors and FF. Install a Garmin 396 for ...GPS signal, XM stereo, metars, TAF, nexrad, car option, etc for another 3000 installed, add autopilot for another 3 grand, and guess what??? You have everything the EFIS 1 one has except winds aloft (396 can compute them for you). Plus, you have national up to the minute national WX radar, AND, you have your standby airdata and attitude reference that would cost you more with the EFIS 1 I might add!
A FULL, SAFE, approved IFR glass panel with stby systems and autopilot for what the 1 costs!
Just one very outspoken, experienced consumer's idea on how to spend your 20K in your panel.
Glen
Just to have accurate info about our products:
1) All of our products have field updateable software. We have released quite a few updates for our EFIS that have enhanced the functionality, and we plan on more updates in the future.
2) Our roll rate limitation is 150 deg/sec. Above this, you will get a "attitude indeterminate" message until you fly cooridnated for a few seconds. This limitation has nothing to do with the update rate of the screen.
1) All of our products have field updateable software. We have released quite a few updates for our EFIS that have enhanced the functionality, and we plan on more updates in the future.
2) Our roll rate limitation is 150 deg/sec. Above this, you will get a "attitude indeterminate" message until you fly cooridnated for a few seconds. This limitation has nothing to do with the update rate of the screen.
