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MartySantic
01-24-2014, 09:07 AM
I am looking for anyone that has experience with the SkyguardTWX family as I am looking for an ADS-B out transmitter that will complement my Stratus 2/iPad/Foreflight combination. The only unit that I am aware of is the SkyguardTWX unit. Are any others available?

Has anyone purchased the SkyguardTWX transmitter? Can anyone comment on the performance of the SkyguardTWX Transmitter?
http://www.skyguardtwx.com/UAT_Transmitter.html

Has anyone purchased and installed the SkyguardTWX transceiver? If so, please comment on its performance as such should give an idea on how the transmitter will perform.
http://www.skyguardtwx.com/UAT_TRANSCEIVER.html

The SkyguardTWX website indicates the units are presently under TSO-C154c certification testing. Wondering if this will ever be successful in light of the information on the FAA website.

Looking at the FAA Website, http://www.faa.gov/nextgen/implementation/programs/adsb/faq/

the FAA says.....

Will the FAA allow portable/handheld units, or will they have to be panel mounts only?

Installed transponders and GPS units must meet certification standards. Handheld devices and displays that serve only for situational awareness have more flexibility and are not certified installations. In order to comply with 14 CFR 91.225 and 91.227 aircraft intended to fly in ADS-B airspace must have installed and certified equipment. Portable installations are not compliant to the rule and would only be usable for receiving FIS-B services for situational awareness. The FAA is in the early stages of investigating a portable device for glider aircraft.

I have had a conversation with Stratus and they tell me that Stratus will most likely NOT come out with an ADS-B Out companion for the Stratus 2 because they say such would not be legal. When I asked them to send me a link to the regulation, they said there is no regulation but the FAA will soon clarify this issue in the month's ahead.

Have also had a conversation with SkyguardTWX. They tell me they are shipping the ADS-B out transmitter. I forget to ask them to comment on the information I received from Stratus.

Have any insight? Will the TWX be legal and continue to function in an E-AB after 2020? (YES, I know 2020 is 6 years away!)

Radomir
01-24-2014, 09:21 AM
What is your goal? Fly for 6 years and then have to install actual real certified equipment? if so, this should suffice. You can fly for next 6 years without any care about being certified/compliant. It's a wild west until 2020 where "anything goes"

If your goal is to get compliant now, then I wouldn't look at any portable solutions. I do not foresee FAA ever approving anything portable as 2020-compliant. Let's just say, don't buy on this promise "we're working on certification...." -- but if the miracle happens and they get approved -- awesome, buy then.

Based on how things are now, I'd never buy a portable that promises it'll be compliant.. it just may never happen. The FAA kinda says that in the link you posted.

BobTurner
01-24-2014, 10:04 AM
As currently written the FARs mandate two pieces of equipment for 2020 ADSB, both meeting TSO standards.
One is the transmitter, which may be UAT or mode S-ES transponder. The second is the gps position source.
These guys say they are working on getting TSO approval for their UAT. But you will still need (in 2020) a TSO'd gps. They don't say if they are working on that.

Navworxs (sp?) recently got their TSO approvals for their UAT system. They charge an extra $1200 for the TSO'd gps.

MartySantic
01-24-2014, 12:38 PM
What is your goal? Fly for 6 years.....

Navworxs (sp?) recently got their TSO approvals for their UAT system. They charge an extra $1200 for the TSO'd gps.

Would prefer something now that would still be operational after 2020. I fly the RV-12 with no intention of IFR flight and iPad with Foreflight works perfectly. Foreflight, at this time only supports the Stratus. Navworx is not compatible with Foreflight. Still looking for someone with SkyguardTWX experience.

RV6_OKLA
01-24-2014, 01:11 PM
I recently purchased a Skyguard TWX. I have an iFly720 gps that is compatible with it and also have an iPad Air with WingX Pro that works with the TWX via bluetooth. Foreflight is not compatible. I have only flown with it once and received 5 towers and I believe we have about 8 towers in Oklahoma. On the ground, I could receive mode-s transmissions from jets on about a 10 mile approach to KOKC.

My only complaint is the adsb-out antennae. It's on about a 4-ft coax with a 1-ft blade antennae at the end. Kinda bulky. The unit will not fit on the glare shield of my RV6 so I am relocating it to the upper baggage area(tip up canopy rear window frame area).

There is TWX info on the iFly forum at: http://ifly.adventurepilot.com/SUPPORT/Forum/tabid/108/forumid/14/threadid/11672/scope/posts/threadpage/1/Default.aspx

Maybe the forum can answer your questions.

BobTurner
01-24-2014, 03:14 PM
This is a guess, but I'd bet that the TSO-assuming they get it- will require an external antenna.

RV6_OKLA
01-24-2014, 03:44 PM
This is a guess, but I'd bet that the TSO-assuming they get it- will require an external antenna.

I would have to say that it would be a cleaner installation if the ads-b out antenna was external.:)

Peterk
01-25-2014, 06:17 AM
I understand the FAA's history of hard-wired or nothing but the world is changing. Mobile devices are the future and the feds will be forced to keep up. six years from now is a long time. Foreflight has proven to be the most aggressive player yet. I would bet money that a portable "out" will be in the picture by 2020.

Can you see the FAA trying to police controlled airspace full of TSO'd and non-TSO'd traffic transmissions? Controllers have enough to do now.

Like someone said, $800 for 6 years of traffic watch and radar is not a bad deal anyway...cheaper than XM.

Kinda reminds me of of portable GPS. The 396 made IFR situational awareness an instant no-brainer...and became a back-up instrument for IFR flight.

I have seen many 396/496 mounted on the glare shield of King Airs and corporate jets.

allensilberman
01-25-2014, 06:38 AM
I've been flying with the Skyguard twx in my RV4 for several months. I initially had some difficulty with the location of the blade antennas. I opted to have my local avionics shop mount antennas on the belly of the plane. Using the three antennas with my Ifly720 and also with the Ifly app on an ipad mini I receive the full range of traffic seen by ATC. As long as you keep your head out of the cockpit as well as cross-checking the Skyguard twx data you have the best of both worlds for safe flying. One final note, you can not ask for better customer service than that provided by Don at Skyguard. The unit does not work on Foreflight (I also have Foreflight on my ipad). The ifly and Foreflight are both excellent. The Skyguard is an inexpensive investment in flying safety whether the FAA gives it a seal of approval or not. Six years is a long time to wait for "certified" improved safety.

sailvi767
01-25-2014, 07:58 AM
I understand the FAA's history of hard-wired or nothing but the world is changing. Mobile devices are the future and the feds will be forced to keep up. six years from now is a long time. Foreflight has proven to be the most aggressive player yet. I would bet money that a portable "out" will be in the picture by 2020.

Can you see the FAA trying to police controlled airspace full of TSO'd and non-TSO'd traffic transmissions? Controllers have enough to do now.

Like someone said, $800 for 6 years of traffic watch and radar is not a bad deal anyway...cheaper than XM.

Kinda reminds me of of portable GPS. The 396 made IFR situational awareness an instant no-brainer...and became a primary instrument for IFR flight.

The 396 is not legal for IFR flight. Neither is the 696 much to my dismay.
George

RV6_OKLA
01-25-2014, 08:38 AM
I've been flying with the Skyguard twx in my RV4 for several months. I initially had some difficulty with the location of the blade antennas. I opted to have my local avionics shop mount antennas on the belly of the plane. Using the three antennas with my Ifly720 and also with the Ifly app on an ipad mini I receive the full range of traffic seen by ATC. As long as you keep your head out of the cockpit as well as cross-checking the Skyguard twx data you have the best of both worlds for safe flying. One final note, you can not ask for better customer service than that provided by Don at Skyguard. The unit does not work on Foreflight (I also have Foreflight on my ipad). The ifly and Foreflight are both excellent. The Skyguard is an inexpensive investment in flying safety whether the FAA gives it a seal of approval or not. Six years is a long time to wait for "certified" improved safety.

Did you have all 3 antennas mounted on the belly or just the ads-b out? Also, what types of antenna(s)?

MartySantic
01-25-2014, 09:00 AM
I've been flying with the Skyguard twx in my RV4 for several months. I initially had some difficulty with the location of the blade antennas. I opted to have my local avionics shop mount antennas on the belly of the plane. Using the three antennas with my Ifly720 and also with the Ifly app on an ipad mini I receive the full range of traffic seen by ATC. As long as you keep your head out of the cockpit as well as cross-checking the Skyguard twx data you have the best of both worlds for safe flying. One final note, you can not ask for better customer service than that provided by Don at Skyguard. The unit does not work on Foreflight (I also have Foreflight on my ipad). The ifly and Foreflight are both excellent. The Skyguard is an inexpensive investment in flying safety whether the FAA gives it a seal of approval or not. Six years is a long time to wait for "certified" improved safety.

What type of antennas did your shop install? I am specifically interested in the ADS-B out antenna. I would think a simple monopole cut for 978 mHz should work. Would be just a bit longer than a transponder antenna operating at 1090 mHz. Or a DME monopole may work as DME transmits in the 978-1213 mHz band.

http://www.skygeek.com/ted-104-12-transponder-antenna.html

allensilberman
01-25-2014, 03:28 PM
All three antennas were mounted on the belly of the aircraft. The 978mhz UAT TRANSMIT ANTENNA is the Delta POP UAT WING ANTENNA. The two adjacent receiver antennas (978mhz and 1090mhz are standard transponder pole type antennas.).

Allen

RV6_OKLA
01-25-2014, 04:43 PM
All three antennas were mounted on the belly of the aircraft. The 978mhz UAT TRANSMIT ANTENNA is the Delta POP UAT WING ANTENNA. The two adjacent receiver antennas (978mhz and 1090mhz are standard transponder pole type antennas.).

Allen

Allen,
Thanks for the information. Are the antennas separated by a specific distance?

Peterk
01-25-2014, 04:47 PM
The 396 is not legal for IFR flight. Neither is the 696 much to my dismay.
George

many have installed cheap TSO'd GPS in the panel only to ignore it and use the Garmin portable series instead.

allensilberman
01-25-2014, 05:49 PM
The antennas it believe should be about 18 inches apart.

MartySantic
01-26-2014, 10:51 PM
Thanks for all of the reports. Sure would like to know if Appereo/Stratus is coming out with a companion unit to the Stratus 2 that does ADS-B out!!

DanBaier
07-15-2014, 09:23 AM
Have been trying to contact Don (email & phone) at SkyGuardTWX - no luck. Has anyone had any recent contact - if so, do you know if they are still supporting the UAT transmitters?

Thanks,

Dan

rvator51
07-15-2014, 09:32 AM
I received an email from him yesterday. They are still as far as I know.

MartySantic
07-16-2014, 09:25 AM
Read the following regarding a portable ADS-B out solution. With their current thinking, appears the portable solution will not be recognized by the FAA in the future (post 2020).

http://www.brightcopy.net/allen/avne/51-6/#/64